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Adude
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Posted: Thu Jul 24th, 2008 12:47 am |
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don't want to be a hater, but why does Cambridge need another restaurant? Is it really going to do that much good? These things usually fail in town...this place sounds like ram's head of annapoilis. I love it there, but don't see it being that successful in town. The track record, aside from canvasback, is not very good from this vantage point. grace sent a pre-recorded phone message to its members (that should get all of you fired up!) saying that this new restaurant would include a micro-brewery...I don't think they would have done that if it wasn't true.
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4Godncountry
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 11:48 pm |
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| I think brett you are missing the point. I think that the two can co-exist too! However, it IS their business, right and OBLIGATION to know what is going on around them. What if it was an adult book store that wanted to serve alcohol too! I detect a little church resentment in your voice. They are doing what anybody else should do. get involved and Question what is going on around you or your business!
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Pete Macinta
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 08:15 pm |
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Sue C wrote...
There is no reason the church and the restaurant cant coexist peacefully. True. Like I said below, Cheetah's never gave us trouble. They may have sobered up some after Bennie Smith moved near by  .
Besides, you never know - one of their clientel might pop into church and get converted.
God bless,
Pete
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law_girl428
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 08:05 pm |
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SueCarol wrote: And we as citizens have the right to express our support for this restaurant. I hope there will be a large crowd who will do just that.
And I am willing to do that because I think this is a good thing for Cambridge and the County.
There is no reason the church and the restaurant cant coexist peacefully.
BINGO! Two thumbs up Sue!
I hadn't put in my two cents...no need.... when others are covering the topic which is consistent to a "T" with my opinion.
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SueCarol
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 07:52 pm |
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And we as citizens have the right to express our support for this restaurant. I hope there will be a large crowd who will do just that.
And I am willing to do that because I think this is a good thing for Cambridge and the County.
There is no reason the church and the restaurant cant coexist peacefully.
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brett504
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 07:47 pm |
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That is true the liquor board will decide all of this. I could see if it was a liquor store opening next to the church, them not liking it. But this is a restaurant which could do this town some good. Its not the liquor, that is bad it's the people who over drink that is. There is nothing wrong with a restaurant serving drinks, they should put a rule in effect if they do that they will serve 1-2 drinks to a per person, so they do not get drunk.
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Pete Macinta
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 07:33 pm |
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Hi brett -
These churches need to mind there own business. And some of those people AT Grace DRINK LIQUOR. So who are they to say, what can come into this town and next to the church. The community is their business.
These people are taxpayers too and have just as much say, and maybe even more, than any of us.
The law of Maryland gives them the opportunity to state their case. That's what they are doing, they are not dictating.
It's going to be up to the liquor board or some other group.
God bless,
Pete
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Pete Macinta
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 07:29 pm |
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Thickens writes
WHAT DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE THE PEOPLE AT SUNDAY CHURCH SERVICES WILL BE LONG GONE BY THE TIME THE PATRONS OF THE RESTURANT WILL BE THERE ON SUNDAY. THE CHURCH DOES NOT HOLD SERVICES 7 DAYS A WEEK....... SO CHURCH GOERS GET OVER IT!!!!!!!!!! As far as I know, that church is open about four or five days out of the week also, but not for services.
There are staff there on many days and people often go from church to church seeking assistance. I'm sure that the doors are also open for counseling, etc.
God just doesn't do stuff through His people on Sundays.
When we were at 507 Race Street, we also met on Thursday nights. During the week I was in and out on business and/or preparing for evangelism there.
Also, in the past, in hot weather, Grace has been used as an official cooling station.
God bless,
Pete
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THICKENS
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 07:19 pm |
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| WHAT DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE THE PEOPLE AT SUNDAY CHURCH SERVICES WILL BE LONG GONE BY THE TIME THE PATRONS OF THE RESTURANT WILL BE THERE ON SUNDAY. THE CHURCH DOES NOT HOLD SERVICES 7 DAYS A WEEK....... SO CHURCH GOERS GET OVER IT!!!!!!!!!!
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brett504
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 07:16 pm |
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Churches now a days want to dictate everything, and tell people what they can have and not have, and how to live, dress, talk, walk, and what kind of job they should have to.
I know of a church that ruined someones business and THEY WERE THE ONES TO TOLD THIS PERSON THEY COULD USE THE CHURCH FOR IT.
These churches need to mind there own business. And some of those people AT Grace DRINK LIQUOR. So who are they to say, what can come into this town and next to the church.
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CRIMECRUNCHER
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 06:43 pm |
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| The same problem happened years back when the old Phillips building was sold(was $ General then Colortyme). The doctor who bought it wanted a restaurant and Grace Church fought the idea.
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Jlivin
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 05:51 pm |
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It doesn't make sense to keep alcohol 300 feet away from the church.
What is 300 feet?
Maybe some drinker will come in to church and see what it's all about!
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me69
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 05:50 pm |
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Bret:
The only real difference between the examples you give (a junk yard or waste water plant) and the liquor license is the option of what is not acceptable.
In my option selling liquor near a church is not acceptable.
The church was there first.
They have every right to be against issuing a liquor license.
By the way, please learn to spell or have someone who does do your typing.
Thanks
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mustang1
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 05:44 pm |
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loch ness wrote: Let's stay focused - Denny's doesn't hold a candle to the style and quality of the new restaurant. Denny's and this new Restaurant at 450 Race should not even be used in the same sentence!
I was trying to make a point that we need more affordable places to eat around here. GEEEZZZZ!
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abbeys mommy
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 05:32 pm |
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| alcohol is not the problem...the problem is the people who can't drink responsibly.I know ALOT of Church going people who drink . If the restaurant wants to be successful .then they will adhere to the rules.If a patron appears to have had too much alcohol or is even unruly (alcohol or anything else) they are not obligated to serve them.hopefully the employees will be trained to point these people out.Sometimes .I am just in the mood to have a drink.Usually ,I will order 1 alcoholic drink before my dinner (whatever I'm in the mood for) & then I'll have an ice tea with my meal. That has caused no harm to anyone!!!!! Give this place a chance before you condemn them!!!!!Canvasback serves alcohol as well as that other one up there(can't think of the name..sorry). I can almost guarentee you ,some of these people protesting this restaurant are the same people they are afraid of
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Imagine
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 05:31 pm |
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brett504 wrote: They need to mind there own business.
If they are to mind their own business, then whose business is it? The community, right? Grace is part of the community. I think that Grace has an idea of the establishment being unruly which from other posters I don't think would be the case.
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brett504
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 05:15 pm |
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depending upon who was there first in the case of a junk yard, waste water treatment plant thats different. If I was there first no I would not want either of them. if they where there first and I moved in well that's my problem .
We are talking a business, which is going to do some good for this town.
And having a place that serves drinks there is nothing wrong with that. And there are people who go to grace that drink.
They need to mind there own business.
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Pete Macinta
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 05:02 pm |
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brett wrote..
It is none of Grace churches business, if they want to serve drinks. These churches need to stay out of people business at times. Who are they to dictate what a person can do. They are not paying the lease. Nor any of the bills. These Grace needs to go mind there own business. Some of these churches are getting out of control.
1. They are entity within the area.
2. The people that attend Grace pay texes
3. Every citizen has right to do what they are doing.
4. From what I was told, the license being applied for requires the establishment to be at least 300ft away from any church, school, etc.
5. Apparently the proposed entity is within 300ft of Grace.
6. Apparently the new entity needs a variance or whatever - and Grace, and I imagine all Cambridge residents, could have a say in this matter.
Just like Lochness has the right to ask people to speak up in favor of it, Grace and anyone else can take a stand against it.
God bless,
Pete
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4Godncountry
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 04:38 pm |
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brett504 wrote: It is none of Grace churches business, if they want to serve drinks. These churches need to stay out of people business at times.
Who are they to dictate what a person can do. They are not paying the lease.
Nor any of the bills. These Grace needs to go mind there own business.
Some of these churches are getting out of control.
I think that it is anyones business when it is in close proximity to them. It would appear that if a church was going to put next door to you, that would make it your business. what if it was a waste water treatment plant? A Junk yard?This mentality is what has caused Cambridge's problems, letting anybody do anything! I am glad someone is finally questioning something! If it were the Bar opposing a new Church in their neighborhood, I doubt you would have posted a thing!
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law_girl428
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 04:34 pm |
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Why don't churches who offer wine to signify the blood of Christ at communion need a liquor license? They are serving alcohol afterall....
LOL...Just thought I would lighten the mood....
DISCLAIMER * For those who don't get it or are too tightly wound...the above statement is intended to be dry humor!
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brett504
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 04:27 pm |
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It is none of Grace churches business, if they want to serve drinks. These churches need to stay out of people business at times.
Who are they to dictate what a person can do. They are not paying the lease.
Nor any of the bills. These Grace needs to go mind there own business.
Some of these churches are getting out of control.
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MacMom
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 04:10 pm |
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That made me laugh: I agree that we are talking about two completely different dining experiences.
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loch ness
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 04:08 pm |
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| Let's stay focused - Denny's doesn't hold a candle to the style and quality of the new restaurant. Denny's and this new Restaurant at 450 Race should not even be used in the same sentence!
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law_girl428
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 04:08 pm |
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| I SO want a T.G.I. Friday's!!!! LOL. I believe that the closest one is Dover.
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MacMom
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 03:58 pm |
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I've only been to Dennys once, and I was not impressed.
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mustang1
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 03:57 pm |
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abbeys mommy wrote: this sounds like it is going to be a cross of Applebees & Cracker barrel.bring it on! something could actually open that the avg family can afford!!!!
PLEASE SUPPORT THIS!!!!!
That is veruy true. There are not many places to eat in Cambridge that the adverage family can afford. I mean Portside, and Snappers are a little pricey for a family. Don't get me wrong the food is great at Portside but somtimes I just can't afford. And I for one am tired of fast food, and sick to death of Denny's. Besides Denny's has really gone down hill lately. I went there last week, with my mother and the food was terrible. I ordered a waffle, and bacon. The waffle was hard and cold, and the bacon looked like it had been sitting in the warmer for a couple of days. What has happened when it first opened the food was great, now not so great.
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abbeys mommy
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 02:15 pm |
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this sounds like it is going to be a cross of Applebees & Cracker barrel.bring it on! something could actually open that the avg family can afford!!!!
PLEASE SUPPORT THIS!!!!!
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MacMom
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 01:38 pm |
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It's a restaurant! They serve alcohol with their meals! Unless there's some major detail I'm missing, goodness knows that section of Race Street could use some well-funded businesses that provide foot traffic and activity. Sometimes I just despair that Cambridge will ever get up and running if they have to go through stupidity like this Every.Single.Time.
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loch ness
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 01:16 pm |
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| Thank you, SueCarol. People wonder why we struggle downtown, and then someobody comes to make a million dollar investment and the town and county thumbs their nose. This needs everyone's wholehearted support.
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SueCarol
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 01:14 pm |
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| Sorry for the double post...dont know why it did that.
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SueCarol
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 01:13 pm |
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Last edited on Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 01:14 pm by SueCarol
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SueCarol
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 01:13 pm |
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I think this restaurant sounds like a wonderful idea and they should be allowed to sell alcoholic beverages. Many people enjoy having a drink with dinner and there is nothing wrong with that.
Why is it that our county just seems to naysay everything. No wonder we have so many problems.
If I can make the liquor board meeting, I will be there to speak in favor of the restaurant. We need to help revitilize downtown Cambridge.
If anyone hears when it is, please post it on the blog.
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2times
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 01:07 pm |
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loch ness wrote: The restaurant will NOT have a micro-brewery or brew pub, not that that matters. That is another one of the many misconceptions that has come out of this - I heard the voicemail from the church which specifically referenced a brew pub and asked members to oppose it. It is not a brew pub. More than two years ago, the developer was courting a brew pub to lease the space and signs on the window indicated so but that did not happen, and that is not the case now. It is a family restaraunt. The interior will be designed to look like an old farmhouse and the menu, as I said, will have low priced items like brick oven style pizzas, etc.
This restaurant would be an anchor for that part of downtown, and will greatly improve the surroundings of Grace Church. Grace Church should be be leading the chrage in support of this, not mounting a silly opposition.
loch ness. I'm not so sure the micro-brewery is a dead issue. Micro-Brewery is still on the table.
meinmd, parking is always an issue for that area, however peak hours for the church and peak hours for the Restaurant, should not clash except for Deaths and Mariagies.....
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loch ness
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 01:05 pm |
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From the Washington Post, an article about the restaurant
(to view the article online: (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/05/13/AR2008051300624.html) :
Dish
Wednesday, May 14, 2008; Page F03
THE FARM REPORT: The former managing partner of Bonefish Grill in Centreville is striking out on his own with a restaurant in Cambridge, Md., that he hopes will complement the mix of crab houses and mom-and-pop joints in the area. Tony Stafford says he expects to open 450 Race, a "rustic American bistro," in early November. The venue, halfway between Easton and Salisbury, takes the name of its address. "People won't be able to forget us!" figures Stafford, who will serve as chef there.
The restaurateur has tapped architect Leon Chatelain, who has created dramatic spaces for Clyde's and Great American Restaurants, to transform a former five-and-dime into a place that resembles a farmhouse (a big farmhouse; 450 Race will cover 7,000 square feet and seat 130 customers). Chatelain already has procured milk jugs to serve as water pitchers and seltzer bottles that will be turned into pendant lights.
For his part, Stafford plans to serve "fun stuff," including mussels roasted over a wood fire, roasted chicken, flat-iron steak and fruit cobblers cooked in cast-iron skillets. Watching over the front of the house will be his wife, Ana. Their commute will be an easy one; the couple and their 3-year-old son, Danny, recently relocated to an apartment right above the future workplace.
PLEASE SUPPORT THIS RESTAURANT!
Last edited on Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 01:07 pm by loch ness
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grandma
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 01:02 pm |
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| There is a city-owned parking lot less than a block away and if I remember correctly those who run businesses downtown have to pay a special parking tax to be able to use it.
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meinmd
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 01:00 pm |
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| Could their (the church's) concern be about parking and not alcohol? The parking situation in the area is very limited.
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loch ness
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 12:36 pm |
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The restaurant will NOT have a micro-brewery or brew pub, not that that matters. That is another one of the many misconceptions that has come out of this - I heard the voicemail from the church which specifically referenced a brew pub and asked members to oppose it. It is not a brew pub. More than two years ago, the developer was courting a brew pub to lease the space and signs on the window indicated so but that did not happen, and that is not the case now. It is a family restaraunt. The interior will be designed to look like an old farmhouse and the menu, as I said, will have low priced items like brick oven style pizzas, etc.
This restaurant would be an anchor for that part of downtown, and will greatly improve the surroundings of Grace Church. Grace Church should be be leading the chrage in support of this, not mounting a silly opposition.
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South County
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 12:25 pm |
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I can understand the church's concern being they are accustom to having a business like Cheetah’s or Skippy's. If this is going to be a law abiding restaurant / brewery this would be very good for the community. They have been very popular in many other towns. Sounds to me like the church doesn't want gov't control but certainly welcomes gov't help.
I do think the town should be careful. There are plenty of law abiding restaurants that sell alcohol without causing problems in the community. However we sure do not need any more breeding grounds for crime or drugs like some of the bars on Race St have been.
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SueCarol
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 12:14 pm |
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Go to the liquor board hearing and speak your minds.
And remember, IF there really is separation of church and state (I dont believe there is but the Supremes have ajudicated it as such) then the 300 ft law would be in violation and not valid.
Last edited on Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 12:14 pm by SueCarol
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2times
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 07:47 am |
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Loch Ness, well said, it will not be a Cheetah's Pub or Jones Restaurant (AKA Skippy's Bar) It will be of benefit to the entire community serving families of locals and tourists. Let's not let a few spoil another excellent opportunity for Cambridge and Dorchester County.
Lets lend our support to the developer and owner!!
Last edited on Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 07:48 am by 2times
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Adude
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 07:10 am |
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apparently, the restaurant will include a micro brewery. I was a member of Grace from birth pretty much, and now have moved away. I have never seen alcohol at any of their functions. Church has a brand new pastor....he is leading the charge. Some in the congregation support, some don't care. But apparently the 300ft thing is a law.
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loch ness
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 04:26 am |
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The city code allows for liquor licenses for restaurants within 300 feet of a church. The county/state code is more contradictory, but there has been some precedent stating that the setback does not apply to restaurants.
But here's the rub and the most important point. The restaurant owner has an excellent plan for a truly fun, family oriented eatery. It will cater to locals as well as tourists, with a wide price range (similar to that of an Applebee's, etc.), but most importantly, families. This is not some dive bar. The law's intent was to keep liquor stores out of sight from churches, not prevent legitimate restaurants from opening their doors.
The owner and developer are investing millions into our downtown, and should be praised and thanked, not treated like criminals. This and several other projects underway can systematically revitalize our downtown. The five people on the liquor board clinging to an antiquated law should not have the power to kill an entire project. Please speak to your county councilman and ask them to support the license and to convey that to their liquor board rep.
Last edited on Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 04:27 am by loch ness
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Imagine
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 03:44 am |
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Does their banquet (if they have them) facilities allow alcohol for wedding receptions? If so, that seems a little hypocritical. But if there is a law about it, then the law should be followed. Period.
Last edited on Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 03:45 am by
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Pete Macinta
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 03:43 am |
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Greetings 2times,
It might take a good bit to find the actual law. I know if I try to read city charter or the county code it's a bit difficult for me to understand.
I do know at least one member of the liquor board is opposed to it.
On LMS, I guess that's not classified as a church. I do my shopping there !
God bless,
Pete
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2times
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 03:28 am |
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Of course the Restaurant wants to serve Alcohol. What's the big deal. The Lutheran Mission has services in their building and they are across from Canvas Back Restaurant. Maybe that is not classified as a church even though they hold services there.
I don't see the issue here, can anyone state the law on this or is it just some upset Church members?
Has anyone measured the distance from Point Breaks (Canvas Backs Back Door) door to the Church on Academy Street?
Last edited on Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 03:42 am by 2times
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Pete Macinta
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 02:45 am |
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CC asked,
As a denomination, aren't Methodists dry like Baptists? That I don't know CC.
Having substituted in Methodist churches in Garret County, it might vary from church to church, but I don't know.
God bless,
Pete
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CRIMECRUNCHER
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 02:37 am |
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| What I meant was that most folks go to a bar to get inebriated, most folks go to a greasy spoon to eat and some like to have a cocktail or two with a meal. Cheetahs should not havve had a restaurant license as very little of their income derived from food. As a denomination, aren't Methodists dry like Baptists?
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Pete Macinta
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 02:34 am |
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CC wrote...
A restaurant is a different situation Yes, but what I heard was this restaurant will be serving some type of alcohol.
A few years back, we had our church location almost directly across from Cheetah's Pub. They were there first so I imagine just because a church pops up across the street would not matter.
Anyhow, frankly, we never had any trouble from anyone over at Cheetah's.
We got a chuckle though when Bennie Smith moved next to them.
God bless,
Pete
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CRIMECRUNCHER
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 02:26 am |
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| I do not know the substance of the ordinance. I can see a church objecting to a bar, especially considering some of the bars that have been on Race St over the years. A restaurant is a different situation
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Pete Macinta
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Posted: Wed Jul 23rd, 2008 02:13 am |
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CC writes
The old High Spot had a liquor license, and they were just a couple hundred feet from Christ Church. Yes, I remember.
Maybe they were just over 300ft away (I heard it had to be measured from door to door), or, if not, maybe they got some sort of variance?
God bless,
Pete
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