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leslie starks
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Posted: Sat Mar 24th, 2007 08:38 pm |
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| x Last edited on Wed Mar 28th, 2007 04:09 pm by leslie starks
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Dorothy7
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Posted: Fri Mar 23rd, 2007 01:24 pm |
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Bingo wrote:
Greatly reduced prices, get your head out of the SandTrap. Prices are $154,300 to $243,000. There are 94 homes listed for sale. Sales are slow everywhere at this time, not just in Dreamland. Hang in there everyone, the market is suppose to get better in 2008. We can weather this storm and get on with living the good life. I understand the issues and wish Maxwell would crawl back into the hellhole he came out of.
Dorothy responds:
Those asking prices, not selling prices. My neighbors down the street are now into the second year of trying to get just over $100k. Before all this B.S. they had been offered $210k for the same house. It's the problem with getting clear title that hangs us. I couldn't agree more about Maxwell. This club needs an attorney like my dog needs fleas. Dorothy7
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Bingo
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Posted: Fri Mar 23rd, 2007 12:36 am |
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Greatly reduced prices, get your head out of the SandTrap. Prices are $154,300 to $243,000. There are 94 homes listed for sale. Sales are slow everywhere at this time, not just in Dreamland. Hang in there everyone, the market is suppose to get better in 2008. We can weather this storm and get on with living the good life. I understand the issues and wish Maxwell would crawl back into the hellhole he came out of.
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Ron & Cathy Ehninger
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Posted: Thu Mar 22nd, 2007 01:41 pm |
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Babel on and on and on and on and on,
What part of Beep Beep Beep and justice do you consider Babel? Humm you always start off with a thought but never complete it, that is unless it is about the pot lucks, bingo, concerts and shows that seem to delight you so much. First stages of dementia ? Where is the report on the Dakota Kid ? Been waiting in anticipation for sure.
PARTY ON DUDES
R
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Thu Mar 22nd, 2007 01:14 pm |
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| R: And you say I babel!
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Ron & Cathy Ehninger
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Posted: Tue Mar 20th, 2007 01:58 pm |
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Oh yes Babel on and on and on and on,
We wait. We wait and watch. We wait and watch and listen and that is what we have always done and always will. You can bet the Club and cronies hate it, but tough nuggies. We don't hide behind an alias, we don't use some guise to speak our thoughts. We are what we are and we hold fast to it. The wheels of justice are grinding slowly but powerfully along in Nightmare Villa.
Beep Beep Beep Beep.
PARTY ON DUDES
R
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Mon Mar 19th, 2007 01:03 pm |
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R & Dorothy7: That is all true! And so today we are waitng for the results of the legal actions.
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Ron & Cathy Ehninger
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Posted: Sun Mar 18th, 2007 02:33 pm |
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BABLE ON AND ON AND SO HAPPY BEING A DOER,
YEAH , RIGHT , THE DEAL THAT WE GET IN NIGHTMARE VILLA IS THE SHAFT. READ THE SADR , FRONT TO BACK THAT IS ATTACHED TO OUR PROPERTY DEEDS. WHEN THEY DECIDED TO FILE THAT ON OUR PROPERTY, THEY STARTED THIS FIGHT. GUESS THEY DIDN'T COUNT ON SOME BEING ABLE TO DEFEND AND GETTING MADDER THAN HELL.
PARTY ON DUDES
R
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Dorothy7
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Posted: Sun Mar 18th, 2007 02:07 pm |
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alasbabylon wrote: Dorothy7: Our friend lived near Power & Jensen 6-8 years ago and paid $40 a MONTH with a couple of common areas and 1 pool! $480 a year.
I know this is not the issue at hand, Dreamland is a deal! Did they also have other obligations to owners? I assume that they also agreed to the monthly fee at the time of purchase of their property and knew they had an obligation to their HOA. None of the above is true in the DV case. Your friend is lucky. She was at least notified that she had agreed to a contract with them. Dorothy
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Sun Mar 18th, 2007 01:51 pm |
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Dorothy7: Our friend lived near Power & Jensen 6-8 years ago and paid $40 a MONTH with a couple of common areas and 1 pool! $480 a year.
I know this is not the issue at hand, Dreamland is a deal!
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Sun Mar 18th, 2007 01:16 pm |
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R: You Said "NOW DO YOU SEE HOW THEY CAN BUILD A NEW CLUBHOUSE ON THE GOLF COURSE AND ALL OF US PAY FOR IT LIKE OUR NEIGHBORS IN APACHE WELLS ?"
You some how always fail to mention " they " is the majority of the community. To imply that a Board can do this is false!
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Dorothy7
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Posted: Sun Mar 18th, 2007 11:51 am |
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Puzzled wrote: Sorry, Dorothy, but if memory serves me correctly we were paying $45 a year for dues when I first bought here (about 1986) and joined the VOLUNTARY club. My drugs and medical bills keep going up every year but I paid my dues until this mess started and now I won't give them a dime to spend on lawyers. Keep up the good work!
Wanda Dear Wanda: I was living in a condominium in Scottsdale at the time about which I was writing...not DV. Good to hear from you...I am optomistic that the club members themselves will put a stop to this half-baked HOA on the sneak scheme these past few boards have been conspiring to achieve.
When it became necessary for the club to vote to lien the property of 40 of their neighbors, on December 13, 2006, the real intent of the club becomes glaringly apparent. With, or without their high-handed harrassment of owners who object to placing such heavy burdens on their friends and neighbors. Over the years of this fiasco's day to day revelations after receiving assurances in The Citizen from Board Members that "You would not lose your Homestead Exemption, your right to vote, your governing documents, your control of your property" etc. etc. etc., we now discover that the club has been purging those elected to board who question anything their attorney suggests. Concerned Citizens have been telling it like it is, after all. We have kept all the Citizens dating back to 2001, and find that their story changes from month to month regarding the effects of SADR. I am approached almost daily, either in person, or by telephone, or on this blog by people who tell me that they are afraid to speak out at meetings for fear that the board will find a way to lien their property or expel them from membership, or both. Nearly all member's rights to which we had become accustomed at meetings and in voting over the years have been destroyed. I asked the question; How many absentee votes were cast during the February elections? No answer. It is impossible to receive a straight answer to simple questions from the Boards who are eerily unanimous in all their opinions. They respond that they cannot respond because their attorney has told them not to. Or that you will have to contact their attorney: then they say, you cannot contact their attorney for answers because he represents only the Board, and members who pay his fees have no right to consult him for explanations that the board refuses to give. To this day, I have received no explanation of my expulsion on December 12, 2006, or subsequent attempts to expel.
They are now saying that because I refused an invitation to meet with their attorney, at this office for 15 minutes, without having been notified of any violations in effect prior to my expulsion, that I have now been legally expelled.
These acts are, unethical, unlawful, and in violation of their own rules. I refuse to accept their authority to expel anyone without first notifying them of the rules they have been charged with violating, and were in effect at the time of the expulsion. Dorothy7
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Puzzled
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Posted: Sun Mar 18th, 2007 01:22 am |
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Sorry, Dorothy, but if memory serves me correctly we were paying $45 a year for dues when I first bought here (about 1986) and joined the VOLUNTARY club. My drugs and medical bills keep going up every year but I paid my dues until this mess started and now I won't give them a dime to spend on lawyers. Keep up the good work!
Wanda
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Dorothy7
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Posted: Sat Mar 17th, 2007 03:17 pm |
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Ron & Cathy Ehninger wrote: SECTION 2. PURPOSE OF ASSESSMENTS. THE ASSESSMENTS LEVIED BY THE CORPORATION SHALL BE USED EXCLUSIVELY TO PROMOTE THE RECREATION, HEALTH SAFETY AND WELFARE OF THE RESIDENTS IN THE PROPERTIES AND FOR THE IMPROVEMENT, MAINTENANCE, AND REPLACEMENT OF THE COMMON AREAS, AND FOR SUCH OTHER PURPOSES AS MAY BE APPROPRIATE UNDER THIS DECLARATION, THE ARTICLES, BYLAWS, RULES OR APPLICABLE LAW. In my tenure as an owner in a REAL HOA in Scottsdale for over 10 years, let me add that "assessments" are not only dues...they can be added each month, each year, and encumber you for years to come. They subject each owner to the penalties, interest, liens, foreclosure and eviction on non-payment as dues. Our actual dues started at 77.00...within a few months they went to 88.00; then 94.00 ect. etc. The "assessments levied for painting the fence, maintaining the pools, landscaping improvements etc. etc. (which was actually in the declarations over there at the time of purchase) were levied as assessments, and our dues went to defray the costs of our management company. None of the owners knew month to month what our next month's costs would be. The major difference in that legal HOA, and this goofy club, is that they actually did offer services, and kept up your property, and the lawns and shrubs. I cannot remember ever had this club provide me with a service of any kind...(except when Billie got the weeds cut on this easement next to my house. Thanks Ms. Lawnorder...'preciate it. Dorothy7
PAGE 11 SADR THAT IS ATTACHE TO OUR PROPERTIES EXCEPT FOR SECTION 6
NOW DO YOU SEE HOW THEY CAN BUILD A NEW CLUBHOUSE ON THE GOLF COURSE AND ALL OF US PAY FOR IT LIKE OUR NEIGHBORS IN APACHE WELLS ? BUT OF COURSE LEASING IT BACK FOR A DOLLAR A YEAR MAKES PERFECT SENSE.
PARTY ON DUDES
R
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Ron & Cathy Ehninger
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Posted: Sat Mar 17th, 2007 02:11 pm |
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SECTION 2. PURPOSE OF ASSESSMENTS. THE ASSESSMENTS LEVIED BY THE CORPORATION SHALL BE USED EXCLUSIVELY TO PROMOTE THE RECREATION, HEALTH SAFETY AND WELFARE OF THE RESIDENTS IN THE PROPERTIES AND FOR THE IMPROVEMENT, MAINTENANCE, AND REPLACEMENT OF THE COMMON AREAS, AND FOR SUCH OTHER PURPOSES AS MAY BE APPROPRIATE UNDER THIS DECLARATION, THE ARTICLES, BYLAWS, RULES OR APPLICABLE LAW.
PAGE 11 SADR THAT IS ATTACHE TO OUR PROPERTIES EXCEPT FOR SECTION 6
NOW DO YOU SEE HOW THEY CAN BUILD A NEW CLUBHOUSE ON THE GOLF COURSE AND ALL OF US PAY FOR IT LIKE OUR NEIGHBORS IN APACHE WELLS ? BUT OF COURSE LEASING IT BACK FOR A DOLLAR A YEAR MAKES PERFECT SENSE.
PARTY ON DUDES
R
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Dorothy7
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Posted: Sat Mar 17th, 2007 01:31 pm |
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alasbabylon wrote: Dorothy7: You said: No Citizen of the US has to belong to a silly recreational private club to be given a ballot. Think, Alas...Please. Dorothy7
I'm thinking!!!!! You have to be a citizen of the US, not just a resident, to recieve a ballot. "Silly" is in the eye of the beholder. " Private" any legal resident of dreamland can join!
You realize there are people that actually enjoy the amendities and bought property in this community because of what is offered! Along with the peaceful, well groomed properties and quite streets of a 55+ plus community! Dorothy responds...patiently...the right to vote in National, State, and Local elections requires only registration. It does not allow for denying the right to vote to those who dissent from current practices of any of those legally constituted governing bodies. DV is not a legally constituted governing body of anything, or anyone.
I am a legal resident of DV and that silly club has stolen an interest in my property without notice, or the right to vote or even awareness of the terms of a contract they say will bind me to certain financial obligations to them for years to come. The morally and intellectually challenged members of the Board (who are supported by a tiny fragment of owners. The last general meeting failed to achieve a quorum of 100 members...out of what they now claim is over 3,000 members) is now trying to impose a rule that gives the Pres. and VP the power to arbitrarily expel anyone without cause.
I wonder how those idiots ever manage to wipe the drool off their chins? The law is clear. The rules are clear. The Republic still stands and protects us from these kinds of covetous people. It is my dearest hope that our part time residents will take an interest in these matters, show up at meetings and get this mess cleaned up. Dorothy7
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Sat Mar 17th, 2007 01:07 pm |
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Dorothy7: You said: No Citizen of the US has to belong to a silly recreational private club to be given a ballot. Think, Alas...Please. Dorothy7
I'm thinking!!!!! You have to be a citizen of the US, not just a resident, to recieve a ballot. "Silly" is in the eye of the beholder. " Private" any legal resident of dreamland can join!
You realize there are people that actually enjoy the amendities and bought property in this community because of what is offered! Along with the peaceful, well groomed properties and quite streets of a 55+ plus community!
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Dorothy7
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Posted: Sat Mar 17th, 2007 01:13 am |
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alasbabylon wrote: R: Great observation! Mr. Jefferson never heard of Federal, State & Local income tax did he? I think the government was supported by contributions back then! dorothy responds: And Federal, State and Local governments are not private clubs who expel members...deny half the people a right to a vote, and stuff the ballot box and expect the results of the election not to be disputed.
No Citizen of the US has to belong to a silly recreational private club to be given a ballot. Think, Alas...Please. Dorothy7
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Sat Mar 17th, 2007 12:02 am |
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| R: Great observation! Mr. Jefferson never heard of Federal, State & Local income tax did he? I think the government was supported by contributions back then!
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Ron & Cathy Ehninger
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Posted: Fri Mar 16th, 2007 02:01 pm |
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Thomas Jefferson said " To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical. "
Take head Club, Board of Directors and President of Nightmare Villa.
R
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Dorothy7
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Posted: Wed Mar 14th, 2007 02:40 pm |
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Concerned But wrote: R&C & Dreamlandman - Get for facts straight. Dreamland Ville Community Club does not own the golf course!!!!!!!!! How would they be able to build anything on it? You keep saying the dues are (4.00. They are 92.00 the same as last year. No Merle White will not be paying a transfer fee as his house is NOT in a mandatory section at this time. It is only in the mandatory sections that a transfer fee is imposed. Are you sure? The sign claiming it is open to the public has disappeared. It is my deepest, most closely held desire to discover when the Board will understand that the club, and all the villa assetts are the property of those who pay dues. The Board's actions without member approval of late have become bizarre, unenforceable and silly. Yesterday, they adjourned before the roll was taken and a quorum established, so that meeting was adjourned improperly, and they are again in violation of the rules they insist they are charged with enforcing. Mr. Shepard resigned, and left.
The board is now claiming that they can expel any voluntary member without cause, or without any of the rights designated in the bylaws and the statutes. I suppose the next step will be to disallow a hearing...they are required to give any member, prior to any punitive action, written notice of the violations and an opportunity to correct that specific violation before a hearing is convened.
When, oh when, are they going to escape from the clutches of Maxwell, and their mindless obedience?
If they win this round, or another round, it will simply go to appeal, and Maxwell will own them body and soul before it's over. He will walk away in either event because the club will be unable to sustain the expense and stay open. If they lose, not only will they still have to pay Maxwell, they will have to repay all the fees, penalties and interest collected to date, and all the dues paid by those who do not wish to become a part of an HOA, and treble the actual damage any of us claim. Every action they have taken in reliance on SADR will become null. Every false statement made by them in the Citizen can come back to haunt them. All these matters seem to have escaped their reckoning. The first item on the adgenda was to rewrite the Rules and Regulations...are they not aware that SADR has the Rules and Regs? The same document to which they refer as "The New CC&Rs?" Or was it just another attempt to reduce the rights of members? The agenda for yesterday's meeting contains an item that Marcel Hemmons would present the above referenced changes. Thank God the legislature is finally getting a grip on the laws governing these HOA lawyers, and their puppets on "HOA boards". This board, like the others believe they are an HOA. I'll report again on their activities after the Special, or General Meeting upcoming. Dorothy7 (A special thanks to my friend for the use of her card and permission to speak in her behalf.)
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DreamlandMan
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Posted: Wed Mar 14th, 2007 05:33 am |
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Last edited on Wed Mar 28th, 2007 07:45 am by DreamlandMan
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Concerned But
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Posted: Wed Mar 14th, 2007 02:45 am |
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| R&C & Dreamlandman - Get for facts straight. Dreamland Ville Community Club does not own the golf course!!!!!!!!! How would they be able to build anything on it? You keep saying the dues are (4.00. They are 92.00 the same as last year. No Merle White will not be paying a transfer fee as his house is NOT in a mandatory section at this time. It is only in the mandatory sections that a transfer fee is imposed.
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Callahan
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Posted: Wed Mar 14th, 2007 01:01 am |
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Last edited on Fri May 18th, 2007 01:42 pm by
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Ron & Cathy Ehninger
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Posted: Wed Mar 14th, 2007 12:02 am |
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Yeah all big strong men and women , all looking after the community. YEAH RIGHT ! The Independant got it right today, Villa far from a Dreamland. IT IS A BLIPPIN NIGHTMARE ! For all to see. You see they can change the by laws, the rules and the regulations. They can control the board and the votes, how are you all going to like them years from now ? They might just vote to put a 10 million dollar club house on the golf course. Wonder how much that figures per house? Way more than the meager 94.00 per person per year now. If you think that will last much longer, then have it . NIGHTMARE VILLA.
R
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Dorothy7
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Posted: Tue Mar 13th, 2007 08:04 pm |
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Dear Alas: Using a neighbor's card, and her permission to speak for her, I attended the meeting this morning. After refusing to allow me inside as an expelled member, I produced a copy of the Open Meetings Statute (ARS33-1804), and suggested they call their attorney for instructions.
Billie Taparro allowed as how I would never be allowed inside.
I responded that she would have to violate the law to keep me out.
Someone took the neighbor's card, her note and a copy of the Statute in the office, and after some time elapsed came out and told me to go on in.
It was my intention to rise and ask which rules my neighbor could violate to be expelled? She is in Section 7.
All those who were to speak spoke...then it was my turn, and Jane Weir made a motion to adjourn because the board was "intimidated by my presence."
Such gentle, refined and timid souls who jeer, yell sit down, Shut up, Move, move, move trying to silence anyone who disagrees with their high-handed tactics...are intimidated by a single old lady sitting in the front row, waiting for them give her a list of the alleged violations of the rules for which they are trying to expel her? Such heroes!
Yet, somehow they are too intimidated to convene the meeting and proceed to new business? Yeah, right! One can only wonder what new mischief they were planning. Dorothy7
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Tue Mar 13th, 2007 01:44 am |
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Dorothy7: answering your question: If so, how do you explain that the Board, whom you support, demanded that annexation require not a majority of your neighbors to approve, but everyone in the Section?
The city said the 100% was their reguirement, not the board! I was there!
My section isn't mandatory for a couple of more years!
Paying my dues and enjoying Dreamland!
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Dorothy7
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Posted: Mon Mar 12th, 2007 03:46 pm |
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Dear Alas: One last comment for today...since you live with the status quo because a "majority of your neighbors voted for it", may I presume that you are in one of the "mandatory sections"?
If so, how do you explain that the Board, whom you support, demanded that annexation require not a majority of your neighbors to approve, but everyone in the Section?
All of a sudden, when their ox was being gored, they have lost faith in the decision of the majority? See why I smile and laugh at meetings? My finely tuned sense of irony just kicks in and I can't help it. ha Dorothy7
P.S. I could not imagine from the beginning of the discussion why the City of Mesa would want to annex this aging county island. I served on the City Council of a small town in Colorado...we certainly would not have wanted to annex a county property with so many violations of the city zoning requirements. The surface streets, for example would then have been city responsibility...
The laying of sewer lines is very costly...the ordinances requiring certain other health, fire and safety requirements only add to the burden, as does access to all city facilities...such as the waste disposal system. I made a special trip over to the club to ask why they were opposing annexation, since surely they are on the city sewer...but Billie refused to answer...wait and see was her response.
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DreamlandMan
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Posted: Mon Mar 12th, 2007 01:59 pm |
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Last edited on Wed Mar 28th, 2007 07:47 am by DreamlandMan
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Dorothy7
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Posted: Mon Mar 12th, 2007 01:43 pm |
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alasbabylon wrote: Dorothy7: Are these public or private meetings? Wouldn't a person assume since they check membership at the door to make sure we are current members that it is for members only? Does a person have to be a current member to vote in club business?
As a parliamentarian how does a private group " Club" control who is in attendance and control order in the meeting?
As a parliamentarian what procedures are approriate to use to control members in a meeting that continuely disrupt and bring discord to the meetings?
Now don't read things between the lines that aren't there! I think people that check this site should hear it from a Parliamentarian! Dorothy Responds: This club, from day to day lays claim to multiple claims of its powers and legal definitions.
The reason we hired an attorney to pursue this matter is because of this confusion among board's and members as to their precise status at this time.
1. All lots in DV have SADR filed with the County Recorder's Office. ALL LOTS, (except by the Grace of God, and the efforts of Bill Webb, Sections 6 escaped.)
2. The Board, in statements recorded in its bulletin to members (The Citizen) records the following: "The club will be the same. We will retain our Constitution and Bylaws." (DVCC Board President Glauer) Then: DVCC President Cole: "We are a mandatory club. HOA or whatever you choose to call it we will have mandatory membership." etc. etc. etc. (including, but not limited to, we are trying to save the Senior Overlay???) 3. The Court decided, and they pled, that they were in fact a voluntary non-profit Arizona Corporation. That is a fact of law.
Which means, of course, that those mandatory sections now being dunned by this voluntary corporation should not be forced to pay a "private club" any fees, fines, transfer fees, or other alleged obligations unless EVERYONE HAS TO PAY THEM. (that too is the law.) 4. As you can see, the Board is walking a legal tight rope from which it is now in free fall. The misstep was the January 04, meeting at which they failed to garner enough votes to become a mandatory membership club, and you will soon see that the Board and its members have been duped by a slickster and placed the survival of the club in any form at risk. Please try to do a little research on these matters, dear Alas. If the club is, in fact, a voluntary private club, then it must remove SADR from my deed, and stop trying to force the dissidents out of this half-assed little club using Mandatory Membership rules. Dorothy7
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Mon Mar 12th, 2007 01:14 pm |
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R: So you don't want to be happy, happy and live your life as you please! That is all we are doing! From the time I have heard mention of you all you seem to enjoy is to cause ripples in the community. Which is fine when you are justified as you think you are! But you must consider the age old rule on water: You are responsible for the damage your wake causes.
How is that for Babel?
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DreamlandMan
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Posted: Mon Mar 12th, 2007 12:38 am |
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BETTER KEEP THOSE TYPES AWAY FROM CAMP FIRE GIRLS....I DON'T TRUST THEM AT ALL.......
TAKE CARE...DREAMLANDMAN
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Ron & Cathy Ehninger
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Posted: Mon Mar 12th, 2007 12:30 am |
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Shhhh, don't piss off Bable on and on, he is wearing thin these days. Maybe his truthometer is out of wack ? heheh Maybe always was. good stuff Dreamland Man and you are right on the mark, but these jerks don't want to hear the truth, they just want to be happy happy in Nightmare Villa and go to the pot lucks and singalongs and listen to home home on the range. So be it.
R
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DreamlandMan
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Posted: Mon Mar 12th, 2007 12:18 am |
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Last edited on Wed Mar 28th, 2007 07:50 am by DreamlandMan
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Sun Mar 11th, 2007 10:04 pm |
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R; responding to your comments, wasn't there someone that hired a lawyer and filed against the club? didn't that lawyer know when he was hired you can't sue a club you aren't a member of?
whether it is true or not.. if the majority of the residents approved mandatory membership then I go with it until proven otherwise! So until then it is not a small group that are trying to force the rest to comply!
It is a small group distorting the information and scaring a number of their neighbors!
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Ron & Cathy Ehninger
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Posted: Sun Mar 11th, 2007 06:01 pm |
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Bable on and on,
See this is part of the problem, a group of " Members" is trying to force " Non members" into paying illegal dues and fees and fines and interest to a non profit social club that hides behind wanting to do good for the community and crap like that, only to be the jerks that hire attorneys, file documents on our property and are trying to take away as much as they can from us? How does this compute even in your warped mind, that this is OK? Morally, legally, our neighborly ? Try to keep to the subject at hand and not babel about some fringe issue like the color of the door and how they check members cards. GEEEEEEEEEEEEE !
R
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Sun Mar 11th, 2007 01:57 pm |
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Dorothy7: Are these public or private meetings? Wouldn't a person assume since they check membership at the door to make sure we are current members that it is for members only? Does a person have to be a current member to vote in club business?
As a parliamentarian how does a private group " Club" control who is in attendance and control order in the meeting?
As a parliamentarian what procedures are approriate to use to control members in a meeting that continuely disrupt and bring discord to the meetings?
Now don't read things between the lines that aren't there! I think people that check this site should hear it from a Parliamentarian!
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Dorothy7
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Posted: Sun Mar 11th, 2007 11:34 am |
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alasbabylon wrote: Board Study Session 3/6/2007 Meeting delayed waiting for Sherriff's Deputy's. Dorothy was trying to attend the meeting. Meetings can't be held with nonmembers in attendance. The deputy's approached her after a few minutes she did go outside to talk with them. The meeting began and all went on in orderly fashion!
FYI! At the general meetings when there are guest speakers, the meeting won't begin until the speakers have left. Only members with the up to date cards can be in attendance.
The board didn't make the rules so don't blame them, it it in the book! Dear Alas: This has troubled me for a week now...WHAT BOOK???
Let me see, we have the rules and bylaws in the DV directory...is that the book?
If so, as I stated earlier...all the meetings at which Maxwell has not only attended but conducted meetings at which I was in attendance don't count? Ler me see his membership card.
There's a real problem here. Either you don't know the rules, or there is a rule book somewhere to which members do not have access.
Until such time as a set of rules that are distributed to all members can be produced to show which, if any rules I have violated, or Vicki has violated, there has been no expulsion of either of us. The Statute clearly states that 15 day notice and a hearing must be completed before any revocation, suspension termination or expulsion can occur. The bylaws are equally clear in that regard. No matter how many post expulsion rules the board arbitrarily puts into place, following an unlawful and in violation of the bylaws and the rules, no expulsion under the law and the rules has occurred. I still insist on a fair and reasonable hearing and a list of rules I had violated prior to the expulsion. Those rules that are printed in the DV directory. Not rules that bunch dreams up to fit their unlawful and out of order actions after the fact.
See you Tuesday. Dorothy7
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DreamlandMan
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Posted: Sun Mar 11th, 2007 07:48 am |
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Last edited on Wed Oct 10th, 2007 03:21 am by DreamlandMan
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Ron & Cathy Ehninger
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Posted: Thu Mar 8th, 2007 01:04 pm |
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Oh shucks, so Bable on and on is not Mr M? Or is he just clever to try to decieve us. How about it , anybody out there figure out who this come early leave late sit in the dark corner dude is ? Humm but maybe he will tell all some day ? Maybe not.
R
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Dorothy7
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Posted: Thu Mar 8th, 2007 10:51 am |
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alasbabylon wrote: R: Just because we enjoy the life style in Dreamland doesn't make us bad people! Why does everyone that disagrees with you have to be the filty scourge of the earth you claim they are? There are 3rd world countries that are led by people with that ideology!
I am not a "you guys" .. I go to meetings, listen and learn. I am not in leadership position, I am just active in the community activities.
Enjoying Dreamland Dorothy responds; Nice try Alas, and partly true. There is no leadership position in the club. It has been donated to Charlie Maxwell. All of the board is united in their willingness to grovel shamelessly at the feet of their leader while he rips off the elderly and infirm with lawsuit after lawsuit.
How did you keep down your lunch when he was denying Mr. Leckey access to the ballots after lying for over two years about their existence?
I shall never forget his intellectual stamina as he announced in a shrill voice, "PROXIES ARE NOT BALLOTS...THEY ARE PEOPLE! WE DO NOT STUFF PEOPLE INTO BALLOT BOXES!" (Never mind that the cut-out ballot in the Citizen was entitled "PROXY BALLOT".)
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Thu Mar 8th, 2007 02:22 am |
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R: Just because we enjoy the life style in Dreamland doesn't make us bad people! Why does everyone that disagrees with you have to be the filty scourge of the earth you claim they are? There are 3rd world countries that are led by people with that ideology!
I am not a "you guys" .. I go to meetings, listen and learn. I am not in leadership position, I am just active in the community activities.
Enjoying Dreamland
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Dorothy7
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Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2007 05:24 pm |
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You should know. The Deputy was escorting me back to my chair when the meeting adjourned. His conversations with the board took place while I was waiting inside the door by the door keeper's table. He asked me to wait there and that he would escort me back to my seat. That the discussion they had with Maxwell was a statement that "it was club business, not the laws."...or something to that effect. It is my understanding he was told that I would not be arrested because I was not violating the law. I watched the deputy walk up to the board and say something I couldn't hear clearly. I don't know whether those in the audience who were standing and milling around could hear, or not. His back was to the audience at that time.
He apologized to me when you adjourned...saying that he did not intend that I miss the meeting.
We'll see what the law does on Tuesday. Until such time as you find it in your heart to comply with the rules, and the statutes and the bylaws and give me a bill of particulars regarding the alleged broken rules, I am not expelled, and will continue to attend meetings. I shall make out another check for my dues and have it at hand, so that no question of delinquincy can be raised.
Seems to me that your actions in this matter are bizarre to say the least. What in the world makes you think that you can violate the law with immunity? You are capable, I assume, of reading the bylaws and the rules. Why not just do it properly with a hearing by the board? Surely you men, at least cannot fear facing down one old lady? Dorothy7
Next time I will not leave my seat. Lessons learned.
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2007 01:10 pm |
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Dorothy7: Did they call the meeting back to order?
He read the statute and the rules, and told them that in his opinion I was not violating the law, and that it did appear that they must provide me a list of violations before I could be expelled, and that he would not arrest me, since he was a law enforcement officer and no law had been violated. At that point, the board adjourned. The entire meeting did not last 15 minutes. I was in the room recovering my purse in which my handy dandy little recorder was whirring away. Will get the transcript printed tomorrow. Too tired this evening...
This didn't happen in the meeting I attended! The first part of your paragraph took place outside the door correct?
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2007 01:00 pm |
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Dorothy7: What you say happened sounds like what I said. I have no idea what you and the Deputy were talking about outside while the board covered the business at hand.
I wonder where R & C got their false information about the Deputy addressing everyone present. When I was leaving and 1/3 of the people had left you were coming back in to retrieve your belongings! He hadn't said a word then!
It is so easy to get thing twisted and distorted getting it 2nd & 3rd party!
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Ron & Cathy Ehninger
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Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2007 12:56 pm |
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There you go Bable on and on, you have it first hand from the lady. No hearsay. What do you have to babel now ? One thing we know is that you are a card carrying, meeting attending voting member of the club so your views are slanted. You are so happy enjoying the nice shows and bingo games and you walk all over your community to get them. You treat a lady like this ? Bull Crap. You guys are a mess. Why doesn't someone step up and be the hero. Oh but that takes courage and determination. Look no farther than Dorothy and Vicki, they have more of those qualities than ten like you. Happy on happy person. Shine your card and be proud of what you are doing !!!
R
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2007 12:40 pm |
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R: I don't know what meeting you are talking about! When I and most others present had left the Deputy had not said anything to us or the Board members! In fact Dorothy was just coming back in to retrieve her things! "If" it happened 2/3's of the people had left, not before all present at the meeting as you claim!
All I can tell you is what I have witnessed! That is why I don't say anything about the court cases! I could repeat heresay but it is never accurate!
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Dorothy7
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Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2007 12:08 pm |
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Dear Alas: What a peculiar view of the proceedings you must have had. The Board adjourned after the Deputy asked for a copy of the rules I had violated. He then told me that he would get me a list of rules. He apologized when the board adjourned so quickly...he was expecting them to do some business, and respond to my letter...and that he did not intend for me to leave the meeting. (which I did not).
Now, here's the rest of the story. The Deputy and I were standing right outside the door. We waited for them to convene...I showed him copies of the rules and the statutes and waited while he read them. The Board did nada, but listen.
Maxwell was called because the Board could not respond to the Deputy's questions without Maxwell present. I told the deputy that the rules or the Statutes do not require that I meet with anyone other than the Board who wants to expel me.
He read the statute and the rules, and told them that in his opinion I was not violating the law, and that it did appear that they must provide me a list of violations before I could be expelled, and that he would not arrest me, since he was a law enforcement officer and no law had been violated. At that point, the board adjourned. The entire meeting did not last 15 minutes. I was in the room recovering my purse in which my handy dandy little recorder was whirring away. Will get the transcript printed tomorrow. Too tired this evening...
I'll be back on Tuesday next, and this time they will either call the law, and attempt to have me arrested, or provide me a list of violations. Without that, there is no expulsion, and since I offered to write a check for my dues, and they said they couldn't take any money from me, I assume my membership this year is free.
Alas dear, still hiding behind an alias, I challenge you to show me the rule that allows expulsion without cause...the rule you added without notice or member approval after the fact of the dismissal Motion, is not in effect as far as my expulsion is concerned.
The unlawful, and not within rules motion read by Janet Massey was placed before this board on December 12, 2006. There is no Rule 8B in either the 06 or 07 telephone book, and I could not have violated a rule that does not, and did not exist.
Furthermore, the original Motion included the phrase "because of their afilliation with Concerned Citizens." Show me that rule. Vicki is not "afilliated. I am, and was a founding member at the time I joined the club in January 06, and you all knew it.
The arrest will be carefully recorded by the media this next Tuesday...I am looking forward to it. Dorothy7
Precisely where in the rules, does it say that no non-member can be present when business is conducted? Surely not in the rules any member has available. It is clear in the rules that any member may bring a guest, or any non-member who has been given the card of a member with a written notice to the board that this person represents me, and speaks for me as my representative at the meeting, has the protection of the Statutes. Read the statutes, and the rules.
(Tell the truth, you been listening to charlie...haven't you?)
Remember Dick Leckey's hearing when Charlie was present when you voted not give the ballots to Mr. Leckey? Is he now a homeowner in DV? hmmmm? Remember the meeting on January 13, 2004 when you were allowing him to conduct the balloting, and the meeting? Hmmm.? Maybe you'd like to try again?
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Ron & Cathy Ehninger
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Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2007 12:02 am |
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Regarding the study session you talk about babel on and on,
You neglected to tell the folks the results. The deputy came and he spoke with his supervisor and once they got the information and the story straight, he told the board and the club in front of everyone present. if they don't knock it off he is personally going to charge them the club with mischevious mis and that has a hefty fine. Dorothy will attend the meetings as she is a member and hasn't been given the courtesy of a fair hearing to answer her critics and those who accuse her. But that would be a demorcarcy huh ? Turn up the heat on the pot folks the club isn't smart enough to know they are being cooked. But they soon will. Today was a good start.
R
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alasbabylon
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Posted: Tue Mar 6th, 2007 04:04 pm |
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Board Study Session 3/6/2007 Meeting delayed waiting for Sherriff's Deputy's. Dorothy was trying to attend the meeting. Meetings can't be held with nonmembers in attendance. The deputy's approached her after a few minutes she did go outside to talk with them. The meeting began and all went on in orderly fashion!
FYI! At the general meetings when there are guest speakers, the meeting won't begin until the speakers have left. Only members with the up to date cards can be in attendance.
The board didn't make the rules so don't blame them, it it in the book!
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