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gk Member

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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 07:37 pm |
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The average Obamanation voter
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mm1KOBMg1Y8
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flyrep Member
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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 06:33 pm |
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Obama and Bush are both poison.
http://www.infowars.com/?p=6126
Just what we need. Old and young do gooders snitching on us for not
sorting our recyclables from our non-recyclables.
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gk Member

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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 05:19 am |
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| I try not to think of those depressing times under the Boy Bush dictatorship. There probably is not a whole lot of outrageous stuff that he can get by with anymore, but the new Communist in chief is just beginning his reign of terror
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Spin Reply Member

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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 04:03 am |
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You forgot!
Attachment: bush-years-sac0904cd.jpg (Downloaded 17 times)
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gk Member

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Posted: Fri Nov 21st, 2008 03:00 am |
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| http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnGj9sKfLls
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gk Member

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Posted: Thu Nov 20th, 2008 10:31 pm |
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Informational only - true of not true
The First Time I Heard Of Barack
By Tom Fife
11-20-8
During the period of roughly February 1992 to mid 1994, I was making frequent trips to Moscow, Russia, in the process of starting a software development joint-venture company with some people from the Russian scientific community. One of the men in charge on the Russian side was named V. M.; he had a wife named T.M.
V. was a level-headed scientist while his wife was rather deeply committed to the losing Communist cause - a cause she obviously was not abandoning.
One evening, during a trip early in 1992, the American half of our venture were invited to V. & T.'s Moscow flat as we were about to return to the States. The party went well and we had the normal dinner discussions.
As the evening wore on, T. developed a decidedly rough anti-American edge - one her husband tried to quietly rein in.
The bottom line of the tirade she started against the United States went something like this:
"You Americans always like to think that you have the perfect government and your people are always so perfect. Well then, why haven't you had a woman president by now? You had a chance to vote for a woman vice-president and you didn't do it."
The general response went something along the lines that you don't vote for someone just because of their sex. Besides, you don't vote for vice-president, but the president and vice-president as a ticket.
"Well, I think you are going to be surprised when you get a black president very soon."
The consensus we expressed was that we didn't think there was anything innately barring that. The right person at the right time and sure, America would try to vote for the right person, be he or she black or not.
"What if I told you that you will have a black president very soon and he will be a Communist?"
The out-of-the-blue remark was met by our stares. She continued, "Well, you will; and he will be a Communist."
It was then that the husband unsuccessfully tried to change the subject; but she was on a roll and would have nothing of it. One of us asked, "It sounds like you know something we don't know."
"Yes, it is true. This is not some idle talk. He is already born and he is educated and being groomed to be president right now. You will be impressed to know that he has gone to the best schools of Presidents. He is what you call "Ivy League". You don't believe me, but he is real and I even know his name. His name is Barack. His mother is white and American and his father is black from Africa. That's right, a chocolate baby! And he's going to be your President."
She became more and more smug as she presented her stream of detailed knowledge and predictions so matter-of-factly - as though all were foregone conclusions. "It's all been thought out. His father is not an American black so he won't have that social slave stigma. He is intelligent and he is half white and has been raised from the cradle to be an atheist and a Communist. He's gone to the finest schools. He is being guided every step of the way and he will be irresistible to America."
We sat there not knowing what to say. She was obviously very happy that the Communists were doing this and that it would somehow be a thumbing of their collective noses at America: they would give us a black president and he'd be a Communist to boot. She made it quite obvious that she thought that this was going to breathe new life into world Communism. From this and other conversations with her, she always asserted that Communism was far from dead.
She was full of little details about him that she was eager to relate. I thought that maybe she was trying to show off that this truly was a real person and not just hot air.
She rattled off a complete litany. He was from Hawaii. He went to school in California. He lived in Chicago. He was soon to be elected to the legislature. "Have no doubt: he is one of us, a Soviet."
At one point, she related some sort of San Francisco connection, but I didn't understand what the point was and don't recall much about that. I was just left with the notion that she considered the city to be some sort of a center for their activity here.
Since I had dabbled in languages, I knew a smattering of Arabic. I made a comment: "If I remember correctly, 'Barack' comes from the Arabic word for 'Blessing.' That seems to be an odd name for an American." She replied quickly, "Yes. It is 'African'", she insisted, "and he will be a blessing for world Communism. We will regain our strength and become the number one power in the world."
She continued with something to the effect that America was at the same time the great hope and the great obstacle for Communism. America would have to be converted to Communism and Barack was going to pave the way.
So, what does this conversation from 1992 prove?
Well, it's definitely anecdotal. It doesn't prove that Obama has had Soviet Communist training nor that he was groomed to be the first black American president, but it does show one thing that I think is very important. It shows that Soviet Russian Communists knew of Barack from a very early date. It also shows that they truly believed among themselves that he was raised and groomed Communist to pave the way for their future. This report on Barack came personally to me from one of them long before America knew he existed.
Although I had never before heard of him, at the time of this conversation Obama was 30+ years old and was obviously tested enough that he was their anticipated rising star.
Tom Fife
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gk Member

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Posted: Thu Nov 20th, 2008 12:46 am |
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Newest development in one of the Supreme Court cases about ObamaCon.
On December 5, 2008, only ten days before the electoral college votes, the nine Justices of the U.S. Supreme Court will meet in private to discuss this case identified as:
Leo C. Donofrio, v. Nina Mitchell Wells, Secretary of State of the State of New Jersey
United States Supreme Court Docket No. 08A407
No. 08A407
Title:
Leo C. Donofrio, Applicant
v.
Nina Mitchell Wells, New Jersey Secretary of State
Docketed:
Lower Ct:
Supreme Court of New Jersey
Case Nos.:
(AM-0153-08T2 at the New Jersey Appellate Division without a docket number)
~~~Date~~~
~~~~~~~Proceedings and Orders~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Nov 3 2008
Application (08A407) for stay pending the filing and disposition of a petition for a writ of certiorari, submitted to Justice Souter.
Nov 6 2008
Application (08A407) denied by Justice Souter.
Nov 14 2008
Application (08A407) refiled and submitted to Justice Thomas.
Nov 19 2008
DISTRIBUTED for Conference of December 5, 2008.
~~Name~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~Address~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~Phone~~~
Attorneys for Petitioner:
Leo C. Donofrio
P.O. Box 93
East Brunswick, NJ 08816
Party name: Leo C. Donofrio
The case will be heard in Conference by all nine judges on Dec. 5
Frivolous cases with no merit ever make it to the Supreme Court Conferrence
Check the Docket yourself [url=http://origin.http://www.supremecourtus.gov/]http://origin.http://www.supremecourtus.gov/[/url]
08a407........ put this in the docket search
Last edited on Thu Nov 20th, 2008 12:52 am by gk
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gk Member

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Posted: Wed Nov 19th, 2008 08:05 pm |
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This post will likely get 1 or maybe 2 people that will bother to read it. The file is large, but very interesting. The attention span of most adults today seems to run in the 30-45 second range, so this will most likely be too much for most.
Years ago I was intrigued by Aldous Huxley and his works, and in the course of pursuing his writings I became familiar with Dr. Milton Erickson. The latter part of his life was spent here in Phoenix, where he died. He was really the grandfather of hypno-therapy. He really did not interest me at the time, but I did read some of the articles that he wrote, but not his books.
I had forgotten about all of this for many years until I just recently came upon this .pdf that mentioned his works. After reading it I can see in practice some of the things that he was talking about. The first thing that you must do is throw away all of your prejudices and assumptions and read it as if it was talking about no one in particular.
Anyone who is willing to take the time to read this will find it most interesting. I am not saying it all is true, or even that some of it is true but when you get into the area of psychology, hypnosis, politics and other arcane sciences it's hard to know what is and is not true.
I never watch any of the political speeches or debates, I like to read the transcripts. Did I miss something?
PS This came from a article that came from the American Association of Physicians and Surgeons in TucsonAttachment: Obama%27s_Use_of_Hidden_Hypnosis_techniques_in_His_Speeches.pdf (Downloaded 7 times) Last edited on Wed Nov 19th, 2008 08:19 pm by gk
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gk Member

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Posted: Thu Nov 13th, 2008 06:42 pm |
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| Thanks!
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nunya Member

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Posted: Thu Nov 13th, 2008 06:03 pm |
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nunya wrote: nunya wrote: The Ministry of Change has a website http://change.gov/
There were pages and pages of details on these pages but it's all been removed except for some very broad definitions (e.g. "fix the economy"). I wish I would have kept copies of all the stuff. Not sure why it was removed except that it would be used against him later when he doesn't deliver - he was promising to fix practically every problem known to man. It all sounded very wonderful - I'm just not sure why no other president has ever thought to fix everything 
On gun control. This is just another area where McCain screwed up the campaign and missed out on many, many votes.
Found a copy of the stuff that was removed:
http://www.kvinet.com/~mack/obama_agenda.pdf
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2 cents Member
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Posted: Thu Nov 13th, 2008 02:55 am |
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Well, well. After reading some of your links there may be some ideas worth following up on. I believe some of those jugs may hold water.
That first post, holy crap-o-la. gk, you had me more concerned than usual!
Thanks for the update. Well worth further looking into.
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gk Member

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Posted: Wed Nov 12th, 2008 11:34 pm |
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I know, I know....it wasn't on the Huffington post or Oprah, but here it is, in the real world.
US NEWS AND WORLD REPORT!
http://www.usnews.com/blogs/capital-commerce/2008/10/29/401k-foe-teresa-ghilarducci-the-most-dangerous-woman-in-america.html
THE WALL STREET JOURNAL!http://community.marketwatch.com/group/topic.sync?groupname=us-politics&topicname=dems-target-private-retirement-accounts
PBS
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/retirement/world/ahead.html
AND OF COURSE THE EVER RELIABLE "WHAT THE CRAP!"
://whatthecrap.wordpress.com/2008/10/28/dr-teresa-ghilarducci-on-abolishing-401k-plans-audio/
There may in fact be some good ideas contained in her blatherings, but I have not had a chance to look into it deeply enough. I withhold judgement on this until I can read more about it, but at first look it is just plain silly to blow it off the way you did. There is more involved in it than your off hand dismissal.
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2 cents Member
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Posted: Wed Nov 12th, 2008 11:07 pm |
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OMG. I believe half of what I hear from that article and none of what I read. What a bunch of claptrap.
Keep readin' that stuff and you'll give yourself a heart attack gk. Wouldn't want to see that!
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gk Member

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Posted: Wed Nov 12th, 2008 09:15 pm |
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Here is more of the "change" that Obamanation promised us.
This really should pi** some people off
http://www.carolinajournal.com/exclusives/dems-target-private-retirement-accounts.html
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gk Member

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Posted: Wed Nov 12th, 2008 07:39 pm |
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| http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=46MEqEgdLTg
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2 cents Member
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Posted: Wed Nov 12th, 2008 04:08 pm |
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She'll never make it that far, 2012. She loves to hear herself talk. Incoherently. She will shoot herself in the foot many times long before then. Just watch. It is really a comedy!
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Bambi Member

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Posted: Wed Nov 12th, 2008 02:22 pm |
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It's Change you desire? Well, in 2012 you may get that change.....who knows?
I just heard on the news that Republican Governors are meeting in Florida to discuss their Party's "condition". Among those governors attending will be Sarah Palin. She appears to be the current favorite among Republican voters (not me)to become our next President in 2012.
Now for the Democrats, that is a gift from Heaven. They hope she does become the Republican nominee, as she will be running against Barack. Thatfirst debate. assuming Obama's term is successful, should be an interesting one.
Maybe I'll go back to being an Independent.
Sarah and Family for President....and dude.
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gk Member

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Posted: Tue Nov 11th, 2008 08:39 pm |
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Change? Ha ha ha ....that's a good one!!
Obama's Bailout Bunch Brings Us More of the Same: Commentary by Jonathan Weil

Nov. 11 (Bloomberg) -- It's hard to believe Barack Obama would even think of calling this change.
Take a good look at some of the 17 people our nation's president-elect chose last week for his Transition Economic Advisory Board. And then try saying with a straight face that these are the leaders who should be advising him on how to navigate through the worst financial crisis in modern history.
First, there's former Treasury Secretary _Robert Rubin. Not only was he chairman of Citigroup Inc.'s executive committee when the bank pushed bogus analyst research, helped Enron Corp. cook its books, and got caught baking its own. He was a director from 2000 to 2006 at Ford Motor Co., which also committed accounting fouls and now is begging Uncle Sam for Citigroup- style bailout cash.
Two other Citigroup directors received spots on the Obama board: Xerox Corp. Chief Executive OfficerAnne Mulcahy and Time Warner Inc. Chairman Richard Parsons
Xerox and Time Warner got pinched years ago by the Securities and Exchange Commission for accounting frauds that occurred while Mulcahy and Parsons held lesser executive posts at their respective companies.
read the rest here
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601039&sid=aNCFKvAMUQ6w&refer=home
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Bambi Member

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Posted: Tue Nov 11th, 2008 06:32 pm |
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QCVillager wrote: i learned respect and safe handling skills for weapons including rifles and handguns around same age. i guess it went with the territory as they say... we lived on a dairy farm and hunting was a way of life for us.
at the same time, i think there was something much more involved here with the 8yr old that killed his father and roommate. that there is so much press coverage of the killing shows just how OUT OF THE ORDINARY that such an occurance is. this is an aberration and likely has more to do with state of mind of that child than it has to do with the gun itself. it remains to be seen, i won't comment on it further since it is a tragedy with far more questions than answers at this point.
we could start and fill an entire thread about the ideas behind gun control and whether or not those ideas are effective or not.
You learned respect....hunting was a way of life. In high school in the early 60's and late 50's, my brothers carried their rifles in the rear window of their truck. Park it at the school. Role the window up and lock the vehicle, and no one cared. It was a way of life back then. They hunted after school. They never even thought about turning that gun on anyone, other than a bird or animal.
Not so today. Times have changed. Movies; games; all depict gun play and mainly on humans. Allow a younster to watch that and next think you know he wants to try it.
More than 500 children die annually from accidental gunshots. Some shoot themselves, while others kill friends or siblings after discovering a gun.
Here are more scary stats: Americans own 200 million firearms, and 35 percent of homes contain at least one gun. Last year, a study conducted by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention found more than 1.7 million children live in homes with loaded and unlocked guns.
And if you do own a gun and think your kid won't get to it, listen to this: A recent study published in the Archives of Pediatric and Adolescent Medicine found 39 percent of kids knew where their parent's guns were stored, while 22 percent said they had handled the weapons despite adult's warnings to stay away. What's more, age was not a factor in whether children had played with the guns -- 5-year-olds were just as likely to report doing so as 14-year-olds.
The NRA (National Rifle Association) sponsors classes that teach children if they find a gun to leave the area and inform an adult, but studies show kids who take these classes are no less likely to play with guns than kids who don't attend class.
It's the Home and what is taught there. My dad taught my brothers how to use the gun and what not to kill. They watched their mentor (dad) and did as he did. No shoot and kill bloodsport movies (other than Hop along Cassidy or Roy Rogers)occupied their time or twisted and distorted their view of the real world. They were out in that real world, target practicing or deer hunting with my dad; doing the ranch chores; reading books; assisting their neighbors, especially if a bounty was placed on coyotes or mountain lions....then they were with the rest of the ranchers....no one thought of pointing a gun at their neighbor.
You're right. We could go on and on about guns and society. Oh for the good ole days.
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QCVillager Member

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Posted: Tue Nov 11th, 2008 06:13 pm |
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i learned respect and safe handling skills for weapons including rifles and handguns around same age. i guess it went with the territory as they say... we lived on a dairy farm and hunting was a way of life for us.
at the same time, i think there was something much more involved here with the 8yr old that killed his father and roommate. that there is so much press coverage of the killing shows just how OUT OF THE ORDINARY that such an occurance is. this is an aberration and likely has more to do with state of mind of that child than it has to do with the gun itself. it remains to be seen, i won't comment on it further since it is a tragedy with far more questions than answers at this point.
we could start and fill an entire thread about the ideas behind gun control and whether or not those ideas are effective or not.
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Bambi Member

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Posted: Tue Nov 11th, 2008 05:39 pm |
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QCVillager wrote: Bambi wrote: Barack Obama on Gun Control..... Factchecks.
- Ok for states and cities to determine local gun laws (April. 2008)
- FactCheck: Yes, Obama endorsed Illinois handgun ban. (Apr 2008)
- Respect 2nd Amendment, but local gun bans ok. (Feb 2008)
- Provide some common-sense enforcement on gun licensing. (Jan 2008)
- 2000: cosponsored bill to limit purchases to 1 gun per month. (Oct 2007)
- Concealed carry OK for retired police officers. (Aug 2007)
- Stop unscrupulous gun dealers dumping guns in cities. (Jul 2007)
- Keep guns out of inner cities--but also problem of morality. (Oct 2006)
- Bush erred in failing to renew assault weapons ban. (Oct 2004)
- Ban semi-automatics, and more possession restrictions. (Jul 1998)
- Voted NO on prohibiting lawsuits against gun manufacturers. (Jul 2005)
you will understand Bambi if this is disconcerting to MANY law abiding, gun owning and card carrying member of the NRA citizens such as myself.
I'm sorry it's disconcerting. I have an arsenal of guns stored in a safe location elsewhere my friend.....pistols, shotguns, assault rifles, etc. I have no problem with his gun control statements.....Stopping unscrupulous gun dealers sounds fine to me. It's the States that will have the control of local gun laws. Obama is the least of your worries.
We've had two recent deaths of youngsters because of guns. A parent was involved in both, in one fashion or another. The young boy who died at the gun show. The 8 year old who killed his father and his father's roommate. Both taught how to use a gun at an early age, but still absent of the physical attributes in the frontal lobes that stop impulsive behavior with understanding of the consequences of their acts. The father went to a Priest to ask if it was ok to teach him how to use that 22. He should have gone to a psychiatrist or read a pertinent book to gain understanding of the mind of a child....not a Priest.
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gk Member

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Posted: Tue Nov 11th, 2008 05:37 pm |
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about that website and disappearing info
http://washingtontimes.com/news/2008/nov/11/exclusive-obama-deletes-agenda-from-transition-web/
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nunya Member

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Posted: Tue Nov 11th, 2008 05:11 pm |
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nunya wrote: The Ministry of Change has a website http://change.gov/
There were pages and pages of details on these pages but it's all been removed except for some very broad definitions (e.g. "fix the economy"). I wish I would have kept copies of all the stuff. Not sure why it was removed except that it would be used against him later when he doesn't deliver - he was promising to fix practically every problem known to man. It all sounded very wonderful - I'm just not sure why no other president has ever thought to fix everything 
On gun control. This is just another area where McCain screwed up the campaign and missed out on many, many votes.
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QCVillager Member

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Posted: Tue Nov 11th, 2008 04:53 pm |
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Bambi wrote: Barack Obama on Gun Control..... Factchecks.
- Ok for states and cities to determine local gun laws (April. 2008)
- FactCheck: Yes, Obama endorsed Illinois handgun ban. (Apr 2008)
- Respect 2nd Amendment, but local gun bans ok. (Feb 2008)
- Provide some common-sense enforcement on gun licensing. (Jan 2008)
- 2000: cosponsored bill to limit purchases to 1 gun per month. (Oct 2007)
- Concealed carry OK for retired police officers. (Aug 2007)
- Stop unscrupulous gun dealers dumping guns in cities. (Jul 2007)
- Keep guns out of inner cities--but also problem of morality. (Oct 2006)
- Bush erred in failing to renew assault weapons ban. (Oct 2004)
- Ban semi-automatics, and more possession restrictions. (Jul 1998)
- Voted NO on prohibiting lawsuits against gun manufacturers. (Jul 2005)
you will understand Bambi if this is disconcerting to MANY law abiding, gun owning and card carrying member of the NRA citizens such as myself. Last edited on Tue Nov 11th, 2008 04:56 pm by QCVillager
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azsunshine Member
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Posted: Tue Nov 11th, 2008 04:39 pm |
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Bambi wrote: azsunshine wrote: 2 cents wrote: gk, you posting that alternative universe stuff by Devvy because you are just throwing something out there to talk about or do you believe all that crap? I think the quote by Patrick Henry is about the only fact in the whole piece.
2
Gun sales and prices have sky rocketed as well as food storage items. Went last week to a gun store-more crowded than usual, phones ringing off the hook-clerk said it has been crazy there. People are afraid Obama will limit gun ownership. I don't think he will be able to take them away, just limit the type you get. Obama is a supporter of partial birth abortion. I doubt he would be able to have "brown shirts" like Hitler. Barack Obama on Gun Control..... Factchecks.
- Ok for states and cities to determine local gun laws (April. 2008) =RESTRICTIVE depending on what State you are in
- FactCheck: Yes, Obama endorsed Illinois handgun ban. (Apr 2008) =RESTRICTIVE
- Respect 2nd Amendment, but local gun bans ok. (Feb 2008) =RESTRICTIVE
- Provide some common-sense enforcement on gun licensing. (Jan 2008) =What is defined as "common sense"?
- 2000: cosponsored bill to limit purchases to 1 gun per month. (Oct 2007) =RESTRICTIVE
- Concealed carry OK for retired police officers. (Aug 2007) =Got that one right as long as they would qualify as anyone else would have to
- Stop unscrupulous gun dealers dumping guns in cities. (Jul 2007) =what?
- Keep guns out of inner cities--but also problem of morality. (Oct 2006) =cuz there is no law abiding people in inner cities??
- Bush erred in failing to renew assault weapons ban. (Oct 2004) =RESTRICTIVE
- Ban semi-automatics, and more possession restrictions. (Jul 1998) RESTRICTIVE
- Voted NO on prohibiting lawsuits against gun manufacturers. (Jul 2005)
Barack Obama on Abortion..... Factchecks.
- No litmus test; nominate to Court based on their fairness. (Oct 2008)
- 1990: Wrote law article that that fetus cannot sue mother. (Aug 2008) If the fetus is dead, how can it sue anyways?
- OK for States to restrict late-term partial birth abortion. (Apr.2008)
- We can find common ground between pro-choice and pro-life. (Apr 2008)
- Undecided on whether life begins at conception. (Apr 2008)
- Teach teens about abstinence and also about contraception. (Apr 2008)
- GovWatch: Obama's "present" votes were a requested strategy. (Feb 2008) =Political manuvering to sway conservative votershttp://www.huffingtonpost.com/taylor-marsh/obama-present-votes-on-_b_84312.html
- Expand access to contraception; reduce unintended pregnancy. (Feb 2008)
- Rated 100% by NARAL on pro-choice votes in 2005, 2006 & 2007. (Jan 2008) =PRO ABORTION
- Voted against banning partial birth abortion. (Oct 2007) =SUPPORTER OF PARTIAL BIRTH ABORTION JUST LIKE I SAID!!
- Stem cells hold promise to cure 70 major diseases. (Aug 2007)
- Trust women to make own decisions on partial-birth abortion. (Apr 2007)
- Extend presumption of good faith to abortion protesters. (Oct 2006)
- Constitution is a living document; no strict constructionism. (Oct 2006)
- Moral accusations from pro-lifers are counterproductive. (Oct 2004)
- Pass the Stem Cell Research Bill. (Jun 2004)
- Protect a woman's right to choose. (May 2004) [url=javascript:pop_wide('../2008/Barack_Obama_Abortion.htm#Voting_Record');] Voting Record[/url]
- Opposed born-alive treatment law because it was already law. (Oct. 2008)
- Supports Roe v. Wade. (Jul 1998)
- Voted NO on defining unborn child as eligible for SCHIP. (Mar 2008)
- Voted NO on prohibiting minors crossing state lines for abortion. (Mar 2008)
- Voted YES on expanding research to more embryonic stem cell lines. (Apr 2007) =Slippery slope to government paid or influenced abortions in my opinion only
- Voted NO on notifying parents of minors who get out-of-state abortions. (Jul 2006) Should have parental OK. Parents can give more options to duaghter rather than abortion. Minors should have parental guidance.
- Voted YES on $100M to reduce teen pregnancy by education & contraceptives. (Mar 2005)
- Sponsored bill providing contraceptives for low-income women. (May 2006)
- Rated 0% by the NRLC, indicating a pro-choice stance. (Dec 2006) =PRO ABORTION
- Ensure access to and funding for contraception. (Feb 2007)
Here is the born alive treatment law he was stating that was already law....that's why he oppposed it.
The "Born-Alive Infants Protection Act of 2001" (H.R. 2175) became Public Law No. 107-207 on August 5, 2002. The purpose of this law is to establish that "infants who are born alive, at any stage in development (and regardless of the circumstances of their birth), are persons who are entitled to the protections of the law." The legislation defines the term "person" to include "an infant who is completely expelled or extracted from his or her mother and who is alive, regardless of whether or not the infant’s development is believed to be, or is in fact, sufficient to permit long-term survival, and regardless of whether the infant survived an abortion." Furthermore, the law defines an infant who is born alive as one who, "at any stage of development, is expelled from the mother’s body and displays any of several specific signs of life—breathing, a heartbeat, and/or definite movement of voluntary muscles."
This comes from: American Academy of Pediatrics Neonatal Resuscitation Program Steering Committee
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Bambi Member

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Posted: Tue Nov 11th, 2008 03:58 pm |
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azsunshine wrote: 2 cents wrote: gk, you posting that alternative universe stuff by Devvy because you are just throwing something out there to talk about or do you believe all that crap? I think the quote by Patrick Henry is about the only fact in the whole piece.
2
Gun sales and prices have sky rocketed as well as food storage items. Went last week to a gun store-more crowded than usual, phones ringing off the hook-clerk said it has been crazy there. People are afraid Obama will limit gun ownership. I don't think he will be able to take them away, just limit the type you get. Obama is a supporter of partial birth abortion. I doubt he would be able to have "brown shirts" like Hitler. Barack Obama on Gun Control..... Factchecks.
- Ok for states and cities to determine local gun laws (April. 2008)
- FactCheck: Yes, Obama endorsed Illinois handgun ban. (Apr 2008)
- Respect 2nd Amendment, but local gun bans ok. (Feb 2008)
- Provide some common-sense enforcement on gun licensing. (Jan 2008)
- 2000: cosponsored bill to limit purchases to 1 gun per month. (Oct 2007)
- Concealed carry OK for retired police officers. (Aug 2007)
- Stop unscrupulous gun dealers dumping guns in cities. (Jul 2007)
- Keep guns out of inner cities--but also problem of morality. (Oct 2006)
- Bush erred in failing to renew assault weapons ban. (Oct 2004)
- Ban semi-automatics, and more possession restrictions. (Jul 1998)
- Voted NO on prohibiting lawsuits against gun manufacturers. (Jul 2005)
Barack Obama on Abortion..... Factchecks.
- No litmus test; nominate to Court based on their fairness. (Oct 2008)
- 1990: Wrote law article that that fetus cannot sue mother. (Aug 2008)
- OK for States to restrict late-term partial birth abortion. (Apr.2008)
- We can find common ground between pro-choice and pro-life. (Apr 2008)
- Undecided on whether life begins at conception. (Apr 2008)
- Teach teens about abstinence and also about contraception. (Apr 2008)
- GovWatch: Obama's "present" votes were a requested strategy. (Feb 2008)
- Expand access to contraception; reduce unintended pregnancy. (Feb 2008)
- Rated 100% by NARAL on pro-choice votes in 2005, 2006 & 2007. (Jan 2008)
- Voted against banning partial birth abortion. (Oct 2007)
- Stem cells hold promise to cure 70 major diseases. (Aug 2007)
- Trust women to make own decisions on partial-birth abortion. (Apr 2007)
- Extend presumption of good faith to abortion protesters. (Oct 2006)
- Constitution is a living document; no strict constructionism. (Oct 2006)
- Moral accusations from pro-lifers are counterproductive. (Oct 2004)
- Pass the Stem Cell Research Bill. (Jun 2004)
- Protect a woman's right to choose. (May 2004) [url=javascript:pop_wide('../2008/Barack_Obama_Abortion.htm#Voting_Record');] Voting Record[/url]
- Opposed born-alive treatment law because it was already law. (Oct. 2008)
- Supports Roe v. Wade. (Jul 1998)
- Voted NO on defining unborn child as eligible for SCHIP. (Mar 2008)
- Voted NO on prohibiting minors crossing state lines for abortion. (Mar 2008)
- Voted YES on expanding research to more embryonic stem cell lines. (Apr 2007)
- Voted NO on notifying parents of minors who get out-of-state abortions. (Jul 2006)
- Voted YES on $100M to reduce teen pregnancy by education & contraceptives. (Mar 2005)
- Sponsored bill providing contraceptives for low-income women. (May 2006)
- Rated 0% by the NRLC, indicating a pro-choice stance. (Dec 2006)
- Ensure access to and funding for contraception. (Feb 2007)
Here is the born alive treatment law he was stating that was already law....that's why he oppposed it.
The "Born-Alive Infants Protection Act of 2001" (H.R. 2175) became Public Law No. 107-207 on August 5, 2002. The purpose of this law is to establish that "infants who are born alive, at any stage in development (and regardless of the circumstances of their birth), are persons who are entitled to the protections of the law." The legislation defines the term "person" to include "an infant who is completely expelled or extracted from his or her mother and who is alive, regardless of whether or not the infant’s development is believed to be, or is in fact, sufficient to permit long-term survival, and regardless of whether the infant survived an abortion." Furthermore, the law defines an infant who is born alive as one who, "at any stage of development, is expelled from the mother’s body and displays any of several specific signs of life—breathing, a heartbeat, and/or definite movement of voluntary muscles."
This comes from: American Academy of Pediatrics Neonatal Resuscitation Program Steering Committee
Last edited on Tue Nov 11th, 2008 04:04 pm by Bambi
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azsunshine Member
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Posted: Tue Nov 11th, 2008 03:19 pm |
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2 cents wrote: gk, you posting that alternative universe stuff by Devvy because you are just throwing something out there to talk about or do you believe all that crap? I think the quote by Patrick Henry is about the only fact in the whole piece.
2
Gun sales and prices have sky rocketed as well as food storage items. Went last week to a gun store-more crowded than usual, phones ringing off the hook-clerk said it has been crazy there. People are afraid Obama will limit gun ownership. I don't think he will be able to take them away, just limit the type you get. Obama is a supporter of partial birth abortion. I doubt he would be able to have "brown shirts" like Hitler.
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2 cents Member
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Posted: Tue Nov 11th, 2008 01:01 pm |
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gk, you posting that alternative universe stuff by Devvy because you are just throwing something out there to talk about or do you believe all that crap? I think the quote by Patrick Henry is about the only fact in the whole piece.
2
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loki Member
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Posted: Tue Nov 11th, 2008 05:12 am |
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This is a 'Pinal County Public Issues Forum.'
What in the world do any of these posts have to do with Pinal County?
If you just want to rant, go somewhere else.
Loki
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gk Member

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Posted: Tue Nov 11th, 2008 03:29 am |
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What do we do now?
By: Devvy
November 10, 2008
© 2008 - NewsWithViews.com
"Suffer not yourselves to be betrayed with a kiss." -Patrick Henry, March 23, 1775
There is an estimated 80-plus million gun owners in this country. For nearly a half century gun owners have been fighting Congress and the state houses over one anti-Second Amendment bill after another. For half a century, gun owners have continued to win a skirmish without ever winning the war.
Barack Hussein Obama is dangerous to freedom and liberty and your gun rights. In the weeks leading up to the hoax called the November 4, 2008, elections, gun sales went through the roof; the pace continues. Gun owners who paid attention to Obama's record and position on the Second Amendment became very, very afraid. With a Democrat controlled Congress, there will be no one to stop Obama from signing unconstitutional guns bills into law.
Where were the gun owners on election day? If only 50% of gun owners voted, roughly 40 million strong, even vote fraud could not have pushed Obama over the top. If every gun owner in this country voted last week, or close to 100% against Obama, I wouldn't be writing this column. How many gun owners voted for Obama for the promise of 'universal health care'? Congress has NO authority to legislate such a monstrosity that would put a bullet through the heart of an already comatose economy. How many gun owners voted for Obama because he promised to create jobs? The president has NO authority to create a single job. Only the House of Representatives has the authority under Art. 1, Sec. 8., to raise bills of expenditure for a limited form of republican government.
Congress is responsible for the collapse of our monetary system and current financial breakdown. Congress destroyed the finest health care system in the world. Do people actually believe the same old Congress allegedly just rehired is going to fix the problem after decades of ignoring the real solutions? Gun owners who voted for promises that will never be kept will soon see they voted for America's destruction if they don't hunker down, stop trying to fight brush fires and put an end to the problem once and for all.
When will gun owners in this country 'get it'? When will they finally realize the destroyers are not going to stop until owning a gun is nothing but symbolic. More and more laws will be passed until what you end up with is a hunk of empty metal, the clip and ammunition tucked away in the attic as a result of more and more 'safety' laws. Sound ridiculous? The continuing compromise over Second Amendment legislation has not brought your right to own and bear arms a single step closer to the solution.
Now that gun owners have stocked up on new weapons and more ammo, just what are you going to do with them?
There will be no out right confiscation of guns on a whole scale basis. Even Obama isn't that stupid....unless circumstances can be engineered whereby martial law is declared. Then what? Americans shooting at each other? For those who think this can't happen here in America, take off the blinders.
Creating jack booted thugs
Most Americans have no clue about the history of the world. They know nothing about Mussolini's Black Shirt Militia or Hitler's Brown Shirts. Make no mistake: Obama will do everything in his power to create a very dangerous new "force" that should scare the hell out of every American: “We cannot continue to rely on our military in order to achieve the national security objectives we've set. We've got to have a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as strong, just as well funded.”
What Obama has in mind is NOT the well regulated militia under the states as mandated by the Second Amendment. What he has in mind will be hell for this country. Obama supporters should watch this short video; most won't because they don't want the truth about their new agent of "change." Watch this impostor who is trying to bluff his way into the White House as he stands next to a butcher named Raila Odinga, his cousin. Just take a look at what Obama has supported: death and slaughter. Odinga ran on the ticket of 'change' and redistribution of wealth. Sound familiar? Why didn't you see this on your local news or the cable networks before election day? Odinga ordered all records relating to Obama's birth sealed. Now Odinga expects the pay off.
The final solution
For many years I have written about Dr. Edwin Vieira's brilliant work on the Second Amendment regarding the militia. Back in May 2005, Edwin began writing columns for NWVs. Each column brilliantly lays out the history of a well regulated militia and why the states of the Union MUST reconstitute them or we will not survive the iron fist of totalitarian government looming over our heads.
Our very survival depends on the states of the Union revitalizing the constitutional militia. Most Americans have seen how local law enforcement have been paramilitarized over the past 15 years. We the people are now the enemy. Most Americans not walking around in self-induced comas still remember how the FBI, the ATF and our military gassed and burned to death almost one hundred adults and children, some babies, at WACO. We remember how the FBI and U.S. Marshals shot a young boy, a son named Sammy Weaver, in the back and then put a bullet through his mother's head while holding her infant daughter at Ruby Ridge.
Has the time now come for gun organizations in selected states to organize and get to your state legislature the minute they open for business in January? Forget states like California and New York. Their legislatures are too far gone. They are rancid institutions kept in power by vote fraud and an apathetic, dumbed down populace. Real Americans in those states are out numbered by the lazy, ignorant mobs who demand more and more from the public treasury. I believe the states to concentrate on should be: Montana, Wyoming, Tennessee, Kentucky, Idaho, North and South Dakota, Arizona, Virginia and Texas. I would also like to include New Hampshire whose state motto is Live Free or Die, but over 50% of the voters in that state allegedly voted for Obama. Is their motto dead or are there enough real patriots left in that state to get the job done?
How do you build support? Read Edwin's brilliant writing and analysis. His research is impeccable and he provides the solution. I know time is an issue for everyone, so I've taken a couple of his critical columns and put them on audio. Free, click here. If you don't have time to listen on line, download to your IPod or a CD. Listen in your vehicle or in your tractor. Get the CD out to friends, truckers, people at your local gun range in those states. Gun organizations in these states: Start coordinating with all the gun groups in your state and let them know you intend to sit in the face of your state legislature until this gets done. There is strength in numbers. I am hopeful Gun Owners of America will bring their considerable forces into this top priority battle come January.
What do you present to your state rep and senator? The same tool I have to many state legislators in some of the aforementioned states: Edwin's book titled 'Constitutional Homeland Security: A Call for Americans to Revitalize the Militia of the Several States.' Click here. In this magnificent work, Edwin precisely lays out in detail 'the practical political steps Americans should take, as soon as possible, to revitalize the Militia in each of the States.' This can be done as Edwin points out in his book, but not without a concentrated, persistent effort. As soon as the first state passes the legislation and gets the process underway, it will spread to other states.
GOD
Barack Hussein Obama spits on God's laws. Our Father has commanded: Thou shall not kill. Barack Hussein Obama supports and has fought fiercely to allow babies who survive abortion should be left to die without medical treatment: "He refused to support S.B. 1095, which created a cause of action for harm or neglect that would come to a child "born alive" after a labor-induced abortion – supporting instead the barbaric practice of letting "aborted alive" babies die a grotesquely inhuman and excruciatingly torturous death by being tossed into a pan and left to die."
Barack Hussein Obama supports and has fought fiercely (as has his militant wife, Michelle) for murdering unborn babies via partial birth abortion: "After dilating the cervix, the physician will grab the fetus by its feet and pull the fetal body out of the uterus into the vaginal cavity. At this stage of development, the head is the largest part of the body...the head will be held inside the uterus by the woman's cervix. While the fetus is stuck in this position, dangling partly out of the woman's body, and just a few inches from a completed birth, the physician uses an instrument such as a pair of scissors to tear or perforate the skull. The physician will then either crush the skull or will use a vacuum to remove the brain and other intracranial contents from the fetal skull, collapse the fetus’ head, and pull the fetus from the uterus."
As this legalized form of murder typically is done in the 5-6 months of pregnancy or later, how much pain do you think that innocent child of God suffers? This is what a baby looks like in their mother's womb at five months. Tell me it isn't murder.
Barack Hussein Obama has promised his first act as president will be to pass a mass murder free pass called The Freedom of Choice Act.
Barack Hussein Obama supports and fights fiercely for sodomites and lesbians. (WARNING: Very graphic photos.) This is the 'sexual preference' being taught to children in schools. Sodomites and lesbians don't reproduce so they're on school campuses recruiting YOUR precious child. God tells us that men who have sex in each other rectums and feces is an abomination, as well as women who have sex with each other. Leviticus 18:22; Leviticus 20:13; Romans 1:24-32.
Roughly 86% of Americans claim to be Christians. Despite the problems with pedophile priests, which Pope John Paul II did nothing to stop until it blew up into a sickening epidemic, the Catholic Church forbids sodomy and abortion. 24% of adult aged Americans are Catholic. Allegedly 55% of Catholics voted for Obama. How could any Catholic true to their faith have voted for Obama? Baptists, Protestants, Catholics and other denominations go to church by the tens of millions. They go to church and sing about our Lord. They profess their love for Jesus Christ, our savior. They will tell you the Bible (KJV) is the word of God and we must live by his commandments.
If that's the case, how did tens of millions of Americans who identify themselves as Christians vote for a morally bankrupt dead soul like Barack Hussein Obama? How many went to church yesterday and sang glory be to God, but just a few days earlier voted for Barack Hussein Obama who believes he is more powerful than the Creator? For 'universal health care'? For more jobs? For these empty promises, Christians support a man who believes no baby has the right to life because a woman has the "right to choose" to kill that life growing inside her?
Each and every one of us is one heart beat from eternity. If that times comes for you in five minutes, five days or five years, what will you tell God as you stand before him when he asks you why you defied his laws? For jobs? Money? Forbidden, deviant sex? I just wonder how Christians can go to church on Sunday and vote for someone like Barack Hussein Obama on Tuesday? How can Americans proclaim, God Bless America! and then vote for someone who so profoundly represents the destruction of America's moral foundation? When the created believe they're more powerful than the Creator, do they think God will bring blessings upon our country? Will God bless our nation if her people vote for a man who slaps God in the face and tells us His laws aren't 'progressive' enough for the times?
Remember: The Second Amendment is the teeth that protects YOUR right to worship freely. Will you sit and do nothing except 'pray on it,' or join the millions already working to control our destiny and save this constitutional republic?
Constitutional Crisis:
1 - A real Certificate of Life Birth - Hawaii
2 - This is my Certificate of Live Birth I've carried in my wallet since 1974. It has the raised seal from the State of Calif. We blocked some of the data for security reasons
3 - This site is important on the birth cert issue
4 - Here is what they're doing
5 - Call to stop electoral college
6 - Berg v Obama - Updates
7 - Strategy: McCain electors jam the electoral college vote on Dec. 15
8 - Obama and our coming constitutional crisis:
"Constitutionally speaking, Judge Surrick's reasoning is completely illogical and a total dereliction of his duty as a judge to substantively address this most vital constitutional controversy. Instead, in a gutless manner, Surrick dismissed Berg's complaint 10 days before the elections on a technicality of standing, which to any rational person begs the question: If Philip J. Berg as an American citizen, a respected Democratic operative and former attorney general of Pennsylvania doesn't have the "standing" to bring this type of lawsuit against Obama, then who in America does have standing? The good judge in all 34 pages of legal mumbo jumbo didn't bother to answer this pivotal question."
1 - Obama's Brown-shirts Are Coming - Gestapo/SS/Civilian National Security Force
2 - Obama Youth in Paramilitary Garb Chant Propaganda
3 - Indoctrinating America's children - will this be your child next?
4 - The timeline of tyranny: The Democrats did NOTHING to over turn any of this unconstitutional legislation when they took power in Jan. 2007. Think it will change now they have a complete vote control in Congress and if Obama sits in the White House?
5 - Pay attention to history and don't say "It can't happen here." Never again.
1 - Obama to use executive orders immediately: "There's a lot
that the president can do using his executive authority without waiting for congressional action.."
2 - 2002: Where have all the men gone?
3 - Excuses
4 - America is NOT a democracy.
5 - Obama and ACORN officials set sites on gun owners
6 - The real Obama civil corps
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QCVillager Member

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Posted: Sat Nov 8th, 2008 04:01 pm |
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Obamatrons sing 'Obamalujah' over Barackisms
Nov. 7, 2008 01:05 PMAssociated Press
First there was "Obamamania," punctured in places by naysayers crying "Nobama!"
Now, as President-elect Barack Obama prepares for the White House, his message of change, resounding both at home and abroad, seems to have unleashed a barrage of Barackisms. Or maybe they should be called Obamanyms.
Here's a glossary, culled from Web sites, news reports and the blogosphere:
OAS_AD('ArticleFlex_1')
• OBAMAPHORIA: The post-election rapture that swept over Obama's supporters worldwide.
• OBAMANATION: A twist on "abomination," expressed by evangelicals and other conservatives who oppose Obama's stance on abortion, gay marriage and other social issues.
• OBAMARAMA: The celebrations around the Jan. 20, 2009, inauguration.
• OBAMANOS: A play on "Vamonos," or "Let's go," among Obama fans in Mexico.
• OBAMATOPIA: The political paradise that Obama's staunchest supporters hope he'll usher in.
• OBAMALUJAH: Exultation shouted by his fans.
• OBAMATRONS: The policy wonks who will occupy the West Wing of his White House.
• OBAMASCOPE: Media scrutiny of the new leader. (Example: "One hundred days after Barack Obama took office, newspaper editors put the president's economic plan under the Obamascope.")
• OBAMANATOR: Hollywood-inspired nickname for the new president - even if he's got what California Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger contends are "skinny legs" and "scrawny little arms."
• OBAMALICIOUS: Complimentary term used by those who like Obama's looks.
• OBAMALOHA: Goodbye, Obama-style, with a nod to Hawaii, his birthplace.
• OH-BAMA: Joyful exclamation, via headlines in the Kennebec Journal in Maine, the Register Guard in Eugene, Ore., and the Namibian, from the southern African country of Namibia.
• BAMELOT: | | |