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Bill Pearson
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Posted: Thu May 8th, 2008 05:24 am |
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Thanks Winterguy, i appreciate the comments. Having written every word of the brochure, it truly was a labor of love. I was fortunate to have a small but effeceint committee who met several times every month and reviewed costs, ads, color and layout. The minutes from those meetings are at SCHOA and were presented at every board meeting. We wanted to do a run of 100,000 copies (that was the basis we sold ads under), but the committee suggested we pare back to 75,000. The Visitor Center will use them for years to come as we will as well.
I had indicated i would refrain from posting until after the hearing, and seeing as it was held today, the self-inflicted ban is off. Let me say loud and clear; there is no celebrating, no high fiving and certainly no atta-boys. The judge ruled against the order. The fact this mess ever ended where it did is an embarrassment to SCHOA as an organization and to all of us as board members and staffers.
I do think it is important for Gary's sake to acknowledge the commitment he has made to SCHOA. He has given hundreds if not thousands of hours of his time. Before serving on the board, he led the fight to stop the Peoria widening and as the transportation chair he served Sun City residents at a level few have given. He is the only director i know who hands out his card with his home phone number on it and says "call me any time day or night."
This incident has taken its toll on him and cost him a substantial amount of money; for a position as a volunteer. There is volumes more to this story and to the specific reasons the order was denied. My preference is to put it behind us, rather than belabor the ugliness. I will leave that course to be determined by those in the minority. Hopefully we can get on with the business of keeping the community clean and looking good.
Last thing Winterguy, feel free to take some brochures home with you. Part of the magazine program was developed to create an army of ambassadors to spread the word that Sun City is one of the best bargains in the world. Unfortunately we got off track and has never been implemented.
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Winterguy
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Posted: Thu May 1st, 2008 06:42 pm |
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Hi greenleaves,
I don't understand your hangup about the brochures.
When I got my copy I thought it was one of the most positive things I have read relative to Sun City. It certainly was well written and easy to understand. It gave me one source for comprehensive information about Sun City that I am able to show my friends and relatives when they inquire about our Winter home.
At the time we received it I thought SHOA had finally put my annual dues to a good productive use. Of course it cost a lot of money. It is a slick well done brochure that should serve our community well for years to come. I just hope enough copies were printed so every person who inquires about Sun City can be given a copy to read. I assume the Visitor's Center makes good use of them.
Also, any resident who got a copy certainly has no claim that they never got a copy of the CC&R's. Those who want a clarification should read the brochure. Sure seems clear to me.
As a seasonal resident, I will take my copy back North this Summer to show to my friends and neighbors because it makes me proud to be a resident of this truly unique community.
What better use would you have made of the money? Would you really spend it to solicit votes on the ill-timed and poorly written "Clarifications"? Be real. I'm certainly not going to vote in favor of letting you dictate how high my trees must be from the ground, what plants I may or may not grow in my yard, mandatory home inspections, etc. (I'll make my own clarification of the last item. I AM in favor of voluntary home inspections for CC&R compliance when requested by the seller, even tho' I never intend to sell my home.)
It really would be nice to get this forum on a positive note and stop all the negative posturing.
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greenleaves
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Posted: Thu May 1st, 2008 04:59 pm |
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| Bill Pearson, in your posting of April 28th, third paragraph you told me that I did not know what I was talking about and was making up stuff regarding the ordering of 75,000 brochures at a cost of $36,000 without Board approval and now you tell me the cost of these brochures which comes close to the amount. Gotcha again. If you all can spend $36,000 for brochures, why can't you send out a mailing to have the residents vote on changes on the CC&Rs that would be revelant to the times we are living in. The Board did it in 1998.
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xsiv1
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Posted: Thu May 1st, 2008 04:05 am |
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| I think that it would be a really really good idea if evryone would sit back and read Winterguy's post a couple of times. It makes a lot of sense.
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Winterguy
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Posted: Thu May 1st, 2008 04:02 am |
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| Sorry if my last post got the quote confused with the reply. The first paragraph was supposed to be a quote from Bill Pearson's posting. The rest of the message was my reply/comment.
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greenleaves
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Posted: Thu May 1st, 2008 01:45 am |
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| Bill Pearson, if you, Ben Roloff, Walt Patterson, Gary Bourne, and Sam Baldwin would have signed a Code of Conduct months ago, you all would not be up against the wall with this Order of Protection. Some day you and Ben Roloff will have to admit that you did those unethical things. Just get ready, friend.
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Winterguy
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Posted: Wed Apr 30th, 2008 09:24 pm |
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Bill Pearson wrote:
This is all i will be saying regarding any of this until after Gary Bourne's court case. At that point, things will come out that will paint the full picture of what this entire debacle was really all about.
That sounds like a really good idea at this point. I was amazed how quickly this forum got away from the original topic and turned into a vent of all the board members frustrations. Regardless how this court case turns out. There can never be any excuse for a member of the SCHOA board to scream and berate an employee, another board member, or an SC resident. NEVER!! I don't care if you have a code of conduct or not. If any of you can't keep it together you should stay home and find something else to occupy your time. No group of individuals will ever agree on everything. Some will never agree on anything. But keep in mind the reason we have a board is so no one heavy handed individual can dictate to the rest of us according to his or her wishes. Do you suppose that is the reason for voting on these issues? Could that also be the reason it takes 51% of us to change the rules? I think that is called Democracy. I hope you all take some time this Summer to relax and figure out why you are there. As it stands now you appear to be self-destructing.
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Bill Pearson
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Posted: Tue Apr 29th, 2008 07:28 pm |
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"Bill Pearson, I know and also the minority on the SCHOA Board know that it takes 51% of the members of SCHOA to change the CC&Rs. Why has the Board not pursued this instead of trying to make "Clarifications to the CC&Rs".
We have talked to the attorneys and as we stated at least a dozen times, it would mean securing a 51% majority in every one of the seperate parcels in Sun City (and there are near on 100 of them).
"Ben Roloff appointed a committee to investigate Clarifications which they did and the "Clarifications" were sent to the attorneys at a cost of $4,000 and then when he got caught doing unethical things he resigned as President, and stayed on the Board. Funny how he changed his mind about the "Clarifications" when he was no longer President."
This is a bold faced lie and is in fact libelous. He didn't get caught doing anything unethical, he was stepping down because he had spent way more hours involved in SCHOA than anyone in their right mind would have devoted. Further, the clarifications that were sent to E&E were a result of the compliance committee telling residents who were upgrading their homes they were violating the covenants. There were cases where they told residents to remove the arches over doorways in walls. We were attempting to protect residents from the aggressive tactics of those now trying to run (ruin) SCHOA.
As far as the SCHOA Board doing a good job last year, I will agree, but it was the whole Board not just the famous 5 bad boys. Also, the residents of Sun City pitched in to help stuff the brochures, delivered them "door to door". You 5 bad boys cannot take credit for the good things that happened last year.
We have never said we did it alone. The fact is it was a community success story unrivaled since at least the 40th anniversary. The turnout by residents at both the bag stuffing and the route delivery was nothing short of spectacular. We talked to hundreds, if not thousands of Sun City residents who loved what WE (that is a collective WE) were doing. Here's where you are wrong Gs, we can take credit for putting those actions in place, just like we can compliment those who stepped up and made sure they worked.
"And now, you have destroyed all of that."
Wrong again Gs, we haven't destroyed anything. SCHOA is unfortunately a mess right now, but in the end it will be resolved and we will get back on track. We could have walked away and let Tomich et al continue to lead SCHOA into a legal nightmare but that would have been the end of SCHOA as we know it. The course they were on was a lawsuit waiting to happen.
"Also, spending $36,000 for the brochures without Board approval does not compute too well with 1,000 new members."
Where you get this information that is so far removed from the truth is truly remarkable. The cost of the magazine (printing, layout and proofing) was right around $20,000. There was additional printing costs for the materials that went in the bag we all stuffed, but that was less than $2,000. The bags were ordered by the planning committee, of which i had no part of. There was also the cost of return enevelopes, but again i can't tell you how much they were. All totaled it was under $30,000. We used the magazine as a tool for a membership drive that has now brought in close to 1200 new members. In addition we promoted the week long open house and the election of officers (which was independent of the RCSC) elections. We sold ads that brought in $12,500. Anotherwords, we have covered the costs and created an enormous amount of good will within the community. Gotcha?...hardly!
"You stated that the SCHOA Board hired new staff last year. Why don't the good citizens of Sun City asked what happened to the old staff."
They quit. End of story. Sorry, nothing sinister going on here.
Finally, let me just say this about a comment earlier in this thread. I met with Rusty Bradshaw, yesterday and we had a productive session. He was angry regarding a comment i made about the information in the article regarding the Bourne Incident being illegal to print. His contention was/is the court filing is public information. He is correct. My concern was the names and statements of the employees working there should not have been used. I'm not sure at this point if those employee statements (clearly the court filing of the protective order is public info) are or aren't.
My apology to Rusty. That said, this whole thing is little more than a game of control. The minority was frustrated and were/are willing to do anything to win. That's sad because right now the losers are Sun City residents who have a right to expect more from SCHOA than what they are getting.
This is all i will be saying regarding any of this until after Gary Bourne's court case. At that point, things will come out that will paint the full picture of what this entire debacle was really all about.
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greenleaves
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Posted: Tue Apr 29th, 2008 05:37 pm |
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Bill Pearson, I know and also the minority on the SCHOA Board know that it takes 51% of the members of SCHOA to change the CC&Rs. Why has the Board not pursued this instead of trying to make "Clarifications to the CC&Rs" ? Ben Roloff appointed a committee to investigate Clarifications which they did and the "Clarifications" were sent to the attorneys at a cost of $4,000 and then when he got caught doing unethical things he resigned as President, and stayed on the Board. Funny how he changed his mind about the "Clarifications" when he was no longer President.
As far as the SCHOA Board doing a good job last year, I will agree, but it was the whole Board not just the famous 5 bad boys. Also, the residents of Sun City pitched in to help stuff the brochures, delivered them "door to door". You 5 bad boys cannot take credit for the good things that happened last year. And now, you have destroyed all of that.
Also, spending $36,000 for the brochures without Board approval does not compute too well with 1,000 new members. If you multiply 1,000 times $12.00 for each household, that's only $12,000. I know there were some advertisers, but not enough. Gotcha!
You stated that the SCHOA Board hired new staff last year. Why don't the good citizens of Sun City asked what happened to the old staff.
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edgecaster
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Posted: Tue Apr 29th, 2008 02:16 am |
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"Why order 75k magazines when there are only 27000 residents?"
Off the top code watch ~ it looks like you're trying to make soup with old dried bones. How is any of that relevant to this particular topic?
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Code Watch
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Posted: Tue Apr 29th, 2008 12:06 am |
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Your board has been dysfunctional for 5 months. I still have a problem seeing the fault lies with a minority group. I always thought majority rules. I must be missing something.
I think it must be grade school mentality. Magazines? Why order 75k magazines when there are only 27000 residents? Did the minority do that?
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Bored
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Posted: Mon Apr 28th, 2008 10:56 pm |
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| What are we? Kindergartners?? Can't we all "just get along?"
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greenleaves
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Posted: Mon Apr 28th, 2008 10:55 pm |
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| Bill Pearson, by the way I was at the annual meeting in 2007 when you got up and stated that "If you have a violation, we are coming after you". You and Ben Roloff wanted enforcement of the CC&Rs at that time and if you will ask the residents of Sun City, they want them too.
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greenleaves
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Posted: Mon Apr 28th, 2008 10:50 pm |
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| Bill Pearson, no matter what the minority Board members wanted to do, good or bad, the majority would have voted it down. Your purpose was to make sure nothing got done period.
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greenleaves
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Posted: Mon Apr 28th, 2008 10:33 pm |
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Bill Pearson, you can say what you want. I am not a Director's wife. I am a male resident of Sun City.
You are lying about the 75,000 brochures you and Ben Roloff ordered without SCHOA Board approval at a cost of $36,000 and Ben Roloff paid for them by cashing in a Certificate of Deposit without Board approval. Lots of people in Sun City know about that.
The rules never apply to the group of 5. Wonder why?
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Code Watch
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Posted: Mon Apr 28th, 2008 08:16 pm |
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It is amazing that a majority member is so bent of attempting to blame the minority for being the bad gang of 4. If the majority is so good and did so much last year it seems as though the majority can and will do what it wants. What is left out is a working Board that thinks about the residents. Is this majority doing any good or is negativitism the goal? I see nothing wrong with a code of conduct or buyer protection plan. Did you attempt to help the minority? Maybe you don't like it because the majority didn't think of it. When I see my house I would want it inspected. What is wrong with a code of conduct? I guess you didn't think so it must be bad!
Changed the CCR's with clarifications, I see no difference between those I read and what you did with 6 changes/clarifications last year that were not voted on or presented to the public for input. You seem to only see from your point of view.
I would recommend working together instead of destroying each other and perhaps your association at the same time. Good Luck to both groups.
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Bill Pearson
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Posted: Mon Apr 28th, 2008 06:46 pm |
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Hey greenleaves, nice to see yet another person hiding behind an acronym rather than revealing their name and relationship to SCHOA. It really doesn't matter, your comments have spoken volumes and i suspect you are the same person who ran over to the Independent with those confidential employee statements.
As long as you are praddling on, why not talk about the threatening emails sent by spouses of board members. Or how about the times you called Ben Roloff when he was President and screamed at him. I guess the good news is that spouses of directors wouldn't be covered under a Code Of Conduct and they can get as abusive as they please. Too bad your spouses can't fight their own battles eh?
As far as the magazines, you don't have a clue what you are talking about. Keep making stuff up and we'll see how far it gets you. You want to deal in facts, get your husband to take more information from the office and try working with the actual details, rather than your wild day dreams.
Just so we can stay focused here, the four minority members of the board got in trouble because they wanted to push an aggressive agenda of enforcement. They tried shoving "clairifications" down residents and board members throats. The fact is they were changes, and to change the CC&R's it would take a vote of the residents. It should come as no suprise, this poster was one of those who deperately wanted color pallets, architectural review committees and a host of other items that most Sun Citians would blanch at.
There should be no question by now, there is clearly a divisiveness on the board. So much so that it has gotten ugly. I suppose the majority of the board could resign, but then that would leave Sun City to those who want to run it like Anthem or Sun City Grand.
The oddity is, we had one of the most successful years in SCHOA's history last year. We added over 1000 new members, we enhanced our presence in the community through postitive public relations, we increased enforcement of the CC&R's, we hired all new staff and were well on our way to a brighter future with several awesome programs.
So, now tell me greenleaves, just exactly what has the minority done to rival all of those things? That's right, they shoved a Buyers Protection Plan at us the attorney's said was foolishness. They demanded we pass changes to the CC&R's without a vote by residents and now we have the most divisiveness ever in our history...job well done gang, job well done.
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greenleaves
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Posted: Mon Apr 28th, 2008 05:54 pm |
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| Bill Pearson, Director of Sun City Homeowners Association never quite tells the truth and skates around the topic. The CC&Rs clarifications were proposed by then President, Ben Roloff, who asked that a committee be formed to investigate them. The committee met for about 2 months and then sent their findings to the attorneys. The attorneys approved them and they were brought before the Board for approval. The reason they were not approved is that Ben Roloff when he was President did some unethical things along with Bill Pearson, i.e., did not receive Board approval to order 75,000 brochures at a cost of $36,000. Also, Ben Roloff cashed in a Certificate of Deposit to pay for these without Board approval. The Treasurer of the Board at the time, Dee Jakisch, did not even know about this either. When some of the Board members approached Ben Roloff concerning this and other matters such as micromanaging the staff, harassing the staff, he resigned as President of the Board, but stayed on the Board. There are 4 members on the Board along with Ben Roloff that are voting against everything because of their own agenda to try to cause the new President, Bob Tomich, to resign. Those 4 Board members Bill Pearson, Walt Patterson, Sam Baldwin, and Gary Bourne cannot think for themselves so Ben Roloff manipulates them to go his way. How sad that this group does not have the best of Sun City in their agenda. The Code of Conduct was proposed by the new President, Bob Tomich, because some of these 5 Board members were becoming explosive at Board meetings and harassing staff. The Code of Conduct was already approved by the attorneys, but this group of 5 voted it down 3 times. To remove Gary Bourne as a Board member requires 9 votes and the minority only has 4 votes. What are the other Board members going to do about this? They could have voted him out a year go.
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Bill Pearson
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Posted: Mon Apr 28th, 2008 12:41 am |
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Too funny, the "hostile group" (your words) is the majority. Let me think about this, the minority is the right thinking bunch and the majority is the wrong thinking bunch. I think by definition your logic fails codewatch.
The minority wanted to implement changes to the CC&R's via clarifications (by the way, 7 of the 11 directors saw them as changes). The minority tried to shove a voluntary (except is wasn't voluntary) buyers protection plan into existence that was shot down by the attorneys. The minority wanted a Public Relations policy that prevented directors from speaking out. And yes, they wanted a Code of Conduct that was way more than we need (we don't need lawyers to write it for $300 an hour, we can and will write our own that will pass).
There is so much more to this story than what Rusty printed and after the court case is over it will come out. The sad fact here is Rusty has copies of employee statements which are confidential. Those documents can only come from inside SCHOA (and is a violation of the law to be circulated), which gives you some idea how desperate the minority is.
I suspect Rusty understands the law regarding personnel documents and the right to privacy reagrding them. I guess that didn't seem to bother him when they mysteriously appeared at the Independent office door.
We agree on one thing code watch, compliance should matter. We think age violations should be aggressively pursued; we think homes that are overgrown and dumpy like the one on Augusta should be forced to comply; we think those who flaunt disdain for the rules and show blatant disregard should be held accountable. On the other hand, those that work with us should be given reasonable time to come into compliance; that was why we voted in a new, more lenient process (it was the right thing to do for Sun City).
As far as the garages, hopefully the folks answering questions at SCHOA have told you the truth; garages, as long as they meet the setback rquirements are legal. Your shed, if not attached and not grandfathered, does not.
There has been a fair amount of commentary regarding the Carter memorial, why doesn't someone call and ask about how that decsion came about. Majority, or minority?
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Code Watch
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Posted: Sun Apr 27th, 2008 11:58 pm |
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Once again a Board that is out of touch with modern times! I say, why keep this director if he treats someone like this report states. I have been to board meetings and have seen this person's hostility and it is ugly. Code of Conduct? Why not? Every board I have seen has some code to govern it by. If there is not a code, what stops behavior like this? Why is he not gone or suspended?
I have read Pearson's view on the SCHOA and I don't buy it! This is based on being at the meeting and seeing the hostility voiced against the president. Pearson is part of this hostile group. Can't this board try to do something for all of us residents and work together. It seems there is a majority against everything attempted. Clarifications, code of conduct, etc. what gives? Sun City deserves better that a divided board! If there is a majority, according to the paper, where are the results? How many of this Board have been elected? Where is this all going? Can I keep my shed if my neighbor is building a garage? What about all the weeds everywhere in yards I see that keep growing higher and higher?
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RustyBradshaw
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Posted: Sun Apr 27th, 2008 10:24 pm |
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HOA manager files order
Wants protection
from board member
By Rusty Bradshaw
Independent Newspapers
Sun City Home Owners Association board members rejected by a slim vote to adopt a code of conduct during its March meeting, but the issue cropped up again after Shirley Baker, HOA executive director, April 18 filed for an injunction against harassment against board member Gary Bourne.
Filed in Manistee Justice Court in Surprise, the request will be heard 3:30 p.m. Wednesday, May 7. The filing alleges Mr. Bourne was verbally abusive to Ms. Baker April 17 in the SCHOA offices. In the court papers, Ms. Baker claims he used a loud, harassing and belligerent tone when asking why he did not receive copies of information for potential candidates to fill vacancies on the HOA Board of Directors. After she said the copies were mailed, he demanded to get them right away, Ms. Baker stated in her court filing.
“I answered that I would get them as soon as I had time,” she stated. “He started screaming that he was my boss and I need to do whatever he said immediately.”
Mr. Bourne, contacted April 23 by phone, said he was under his attorney’s advice not to make any comment on the incident or the order.
“As soon as the attorney says I can, I will give you a call,” Mr. Bourne said.
The injunction requests Mr. Bourne be barred from contact with Ms. Baker at her home and the SCHOA office. It further requests Mr. Bourne be ordered to participate in domestic violence or other counseling.
Both Ms. Baker and Mr. Bourne attended the April 22 board meeting. However, a portion of the meeting was conducted by Ekmark and Ekmark attorney Angela Potts and she remained for the entire meeting. Prior to the 9 a.m. meeting start, she met with board members in executive session to discuss legal matters. Details of those discussions were not disclosed.
The alleged incident involving Mr. Bourne became known to residents by the board’s April 22 meeting and two offered opinions during the public comment portion of the meeting.
“I believe that because of the actions of one director in the last few days, you should consider a code of conduct,” said Miles Sagan. I hope the board has the integrity to act on what happened in the last week.”
Another resident, who did not give his name during the meeting, asked board members if they had signed a code of conduct as required of all nonprofit organizations.
“We tried to pass one, but it was not approved (by a majority of board members,” said Bob Tomich, SCHOA Board president.
In her request for the injunction, Ms. Baker further stated Mr. Bourne continued to harass her even as she retreated to her office.
“I retreated to my office and closed the door as I had the fear that he would hit me if I didn’t,” Ms. Baker stated.
She alleges he opened the door and screamed at her, asking when he would get the copies he requested. She responded they would be completed within an hour, according to Ms. Baker’s statement.
She also alleges he screamed at her during the March 25 board meeting and when she tried to answer he lost control.
“Pointing his finger at me and giving orders that made no sense whatsoever,” Ms. Baker stated. “It took several board members to calm him down.”
Two SCHOA employees witnessed the incident.
Laurel Powers described Mr. Bourne during the incident as very hostile. She stated Ben Roloff, a SCHOA board member, came to the front office from the community room to attempt to calm Mr. Bourne down.
“Gary made derogatory remarks to Ben about Shirley’s work and derogatory remarks about her personality,” Ms. Powers stated.
She added Mr. Bourne’s behavior disrupted the staff, making it difficult to hear incoming phone calls.
Nancy Bridgmon stated Mr. Bourne’s behavior was such that she almost called the Sun City Posse to intervene. She added this was not the first time Mr. Bourne has verbally attacked Ms. Baker.
Post your opinions in the Public Issues Forum at http://www.newszap.com. Lead News Editor Rusty Bradshaw can be reached at 623-445-2725 or rbradshaw@newszap.com.
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