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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Tue Jun 30th, 2009 06:27 pm |
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Bill Pearson wrote: Wrong again RAP; I stood side by side with Gary Bourne, went to the attorneys with him, to the courthouse with him and was his closest ally. We had coffee yesterday and are still best of friends. Well great. At least you took a stand on something. If you remember right, so did I against his detractors on this forum.
The problem you have is very simple: You claim to know everything, and then spout off without having a clue whether what you are saying is right or wrong. I've taken positions and fought with people my entire life; it's what i did for a living and have seen your ilk a thousand times over.
You do not even have the first inkling of what the battles I have been involved in. But, that is not the issue. Your ignorance is.
We rebuilt SCHOA in three years, battled through so many problems most volunteers would have quit and in the end came out a better, stronger organization. Today Sun City looks infinitely better for our efforts and the organization is doing nicely.
Yes, it does and thank you.
As far as women's rights, that's a hoot coming from a right winger. How do you feel about women making less than males doing the same job? How do you feel about women's being harassed on the job by chauvinist pig bosses? Don't bother answering, i already know the answers, they are all in the republican platform. Again, the Liberal line of bilge about conservatives and women's rights. In fact it was conservatives that overrode President Wilson (a Liberal Democrat) to send the amendment to the states to affirm that women have the same rights (voting) that men do. President Wilson fought to stop them. Conservatives in the Senate and House worked with LBJ to enact the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and the Voting Rights Act of 1965 that a majority of Liberal Democrats fought to prevent. It is conservatives that fought for women's right in Iraq and Afghanistan while Liberal Democrats tried to stop them.
And therein lies the real problem: The right wants to infuse democracy across the world when they haven't scratched the surface on fixing the socials ills in this country. But then that is why Obama and the democrats swept the elections last time around. The average American was sick of the fixes Bush et al imposed on us. Just the facts brother.
Democracy is not an imposition and same goes for freedom. True, the USA is not perfect, but why should that stop the march of freedom and democracy in the world. Would you deny it to the rest of the World? Sounds like you would.
By the way, still waiting on whether you were career military?
Doesn't my nom de plum imply something? Last edited on Thu Jul 2nd, 2009 04:24 pm by Retired AF Pilot
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Bill Pearson
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Posted: Tue Jun 30th, 2009 03:05 pm |
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Wrong again RAP; I stood side by side with Gary Bourne, went to the attorneys with him, to the courthouse with him and was his closest ally. We had coffee yesterday and are still best of friends.
The problem you have is very simple: You claim to know everything, and then spout off without having a clue whether what you are saying is right or wrong. I've taken positions and fought with people my entire life; it's what i did for a living and have seen your ilk a thousand times over.
We rebuilt SCHOA in three years, battled through so many problems most volunteers would have quit and in the end came out a better, stronger organization. Today Sun City looks infinitely better for our efforts and the organization is doing nicely.
As far as women's rights, that's a hoot coming from a right winger. How do you feel about women making less than males doing the same job? How do you feel about women's being harassed on the job by chauvinist pig bosses? Don't bother answering, i already know the answers, they are all in the republican platform.
And therein lies the real problem: The right wants to infuse democracy across the world when they haven't scratched the surface on fixing the socials ills in this country. But then that is why Obama and the democrats swept the elections last time around. The average American was sick of the fixes Bush et al imposed on us. Just the facts brother.
By the way, still waiting on whether you were career military?
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Tue Jun 30th, 2009 06:38 am |
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Again you reveal why you have a problem, your unwillingness to decide what is right or wrong. Why do you think you have had problems on the SCHOA board. You would not judge when right and wrong were so evident as was the despicable attempt by prior board members to blackmail another member through subterfuge and using the executive director to entrap him. Luckily he fought back and won. But what help were you?
Bill, you are a moral equivicator. If you cannot decide that women have rights no matter what the culture than you have abdicated your moral right to decide anything.
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Bill Pearson
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Posted: Tue Jun 30th, 2009 06:03 am |
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So, you're infallible, the pope is questionable...even better for those of us poor ignorant masses awaiting your proclamations on perfection. And as far as your questions i have no interest in playing silly games on cultures of other nations. The world is filled with people who are different than us. I can't say i agree with their peculiarities, but then who am i to judge. On the other hand, you seem to have no problem asserting your morals, political beliefs and religious convictions on them.
By the way, were you career military?
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Tue Jun 30th, 2009 04:51 am |
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And where did I say the Pope is infallible? Inquiring minds want to know? And are you going to answer the questions on women's rights or are you a mysogynist at heart?
So to help remind you:
Which religion is the right one? I ask you these questions, but first you must assume you are a woman:
1. Can you own a car in Saudia Arabia or the majority of Muslim nations?
2. Can you drive said car in the same places?
3. When you are born to whom do you belong?
4. Can you marry for love?
5. Can you marry the man of your choice?
6. If you decide to marry the man of your choice, what will your father do to you?
7. If you marry an infidel what will your father do to you?
8. What religion requires Burkas?
9. What religion forbids the education of women?
10. What religion sanctions the beheading of criminals?
11. What religion sanctions the cutting off of the hand and opposing foot of a thief?
12. Can you as a woman vote in most Muslin Nations? What will happen to you if you attempt to vote. Look at Iran now.
13. What religion sanctioned the murder of 3000 innocent Americans on 9-11? And before you moral equivalent advocates start in, The Christian Crusades were in response to the invasion of Eastern Europe and Spain by Islam and the forced conversion or beheading of Europeans in those areas? the Pope and Europe decided it was time to fight back and push the Muslims out of Europe back to Palestine and North Africa. Remember El Cid and the Kings of Spain? Probably not, as most of you are historically ignorant.
And is self defense wrong?
And if you Liberals point out that in Iraq and Afghanistan women have individual rights, ask your selves why? Might the name President Bush come to mind?
Last edited on Tue Jun 30th, 2009 04:58 am by Retired AF Pilot
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Bill Pearson
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Posted: Tue Jun 30th, 2009 04:41 am |
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Fascinating RAP...you and the Pope...infallible. Your words brother, not mine.
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Tue Jun 30th, 2009 03:12 am |
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Bill Pearson wrote: First off RAP, i didn't say or accuse you of bringing God into the the discussion, i was talking directly to ChrisAZ who leaned on the big guy (or woman) upstairs. You know conservatives are closely aligned to the religious right, so it should come as no surprise to hear how prayer is all of our salvation.
ChrisAZ is entitled to his opinion as much as you.
The thing is, those darn Muslims are praying at least as hard as us poor minority Christians. In the end, no one knows which God is the right one. In spite of your questions, the reality is until we die, all of us are just hanging around waiting to see what the ultimate end holds.
You conveniently avoided my questions and the answers you are unwilling to provide because you don't want to be judgemental. To avoid them is to grant the Muslims the right to enslave women.
And that is where i take offense to religion even entering into the debate. Without regard to ones faith, i think the biggest factor is how we treat one another. It seems to me that any spirituality that brings us closer to interacting well with one another is a good thing.
Is the Muslim faith that makes women second class citizens a good thing?
I have always been respectful of your position, i don't agree with much of it, but having differing points of view is a good thing. No one person or group has a license on being right, yet you come of and tell me i am naive and ignorant. And, the millions of us that support a more liberal agenda are deluded and we exist with a belief structure based on a faulty premise. How arrogant is that?
It is not arrogant, it is a statement of fact. You have a faulty and deluded world view.
Ultimately all of us are entitled to our own opinions. More importantly, opinions are just that, not facts. You used Charles Krauthammer's analysis as if it was gospel. Sorry but it was his opinion of what is happening. If i elect not to subscribe to it, then i'm misguided? How silly is that?
I use his anaylsis because it is founded in reality and correct.
While i understand the mentality that you are right and everyone else is wrong, i don't subscribe to it. My life's experiences have shaped what i think, see and believe. Doesn't make me better than or worse than you or anyone else. I'm not arrogant enough to believe that i'm right and you are wrong.
Your problem is you do not know what is right and what is wrong.
It is one of the reason's i try and stay away from political discussions. I lived this crap for too many years and frankly there will never be agreement on how we see things. I guess the difference between us is i can accept your beliefs for what they are...your beliefs. I may not agree with them but i have no sense that by demeaning you and belittling you i am being some kind of a patriot.
While you continue to tell us all how screwed we are with Obama as president, you have pointed out any number of times how George Bush didn't do all of the things that happened to us all by himself. The fact is there are checks and balances built into the governing bodies and ultimatley the only things that will happen are what those in power want to happen. You can live in your fear of Obama but when all is said and done very little will change.
Yes I fear Obama, but that does not stop me in opposing him. And much can change, witness 1994 and the "Contract with America" and Ronald Reagan and his Presidency.
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Bill Pearson
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Posted: Tue Jun 30th, 2009 02:58 am |
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First off RAP, i didn't say or accuse you of bringing God into the the discussion, i was talking directly to ChrisAZ who leaned on the big guy (or woman) upstairs. You know conservatives are closely aligned to the religious right, so it should come as no surprise to hear how prayer is all of our salvation.
The thing is, those darn Muslims are praying at least as hard as us poor minority Christians. In the end, no one knows which God is the right one. In spite of your questions, the reality is until we die, all of us are just hanging around waiting to see what the ultimate end holds.
And that is where i take offense to religion even entering into the debate. Without regard to ones faith, i think the biggest factor is how we treat one another. It seems to me that any spirituality that brings us closer to interacting well with one another is a good thing.
I have always been respectful of your position, i don't agree with much of it, but having differing points of view is a good thing. No one person or group has a license on being right, yet you come of and tell me i am naive and ignorant. And, the millions of us that support a more liberal agenda are deluded and we exist with a belief structure based on a faulty premise. How arrogant is that?
Ultimately all of us are entitled to our own opinions. More importantly, opinions are just that, not facts. You used Charles Krauthammer's analysis as if it was gospel. Sorry but it was his opinion of what is happening. If i elect not to subscribe to it, then i'm misguided? How silly is that?
While i understand the mentality that you are right and everyone else is wrong, i don't subscribe to it. My life's experiences have shaped what i think, see and believe. Doesn't make me better than or worse than you or anyone else. I'm not arrogant enough to believe that i'm right and you are wrong.
It is one of the reason's i try and stay away from political discussions. I lived this crap for too many years and frankly there will never be agreement on how we see things. I guess the difference between us is i can accept your beliefs for what they are...your beliefs. I may not agree with them but i have no sense that by demeaning you and belittling you i am being some kind of a patriot.
While you continue to tell us all how screwed we are with Obama as president, you have pointed out any number of times how George Bush didn't do all of the things that happened to us all by himself. The fact is there are checks and balances built into the governing bodies and ultimatley the only things that will happen are what those in power want to happen. You can live in your fear of Obama but when all is said and done very little will change.
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Tue Jun 30th, 2009 12:35 am |
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Bill,
I very much resent you putting words into my mouth that I did not write or say. For the record: I have not thrown out terms such as God or other such sayings as an end all be all. Second, I meant what I said about the President being a Marxist. He is following Marx's "Das Kapital" to the comma and period. He is nationalizing the American Private Sector as fast as he can get away with it by executive order and Congressional blessing. GM, Chrysler, the Banks, AIG, Fanny Mae, Freddy Mac, and the list goes on. In my book, his actions are Marxist to the nth degree.
Thankfully Wells Fargo and Ford did not roll over.
And I have never accused you of "speaking with forked tongue." I only believe you are naive and ignorant. What is sad about you is you believe in your deluded world view and will not reexamine the faulty premise of your belief structure.
Which religion is the right one? I ask you these questions, but first you must assume you are a woman:
1. Can you own a car in Saudia Arabia or the majority of Muslim nations?
2. Can you drive said car in the same places?
3. When you are born to whom do you belong?
4. Can you marry for love?
5. Can you marry the man of your choice?
6. If you decide to marry the man of your choice, what will your father do to you?
7. If you marry an infidel what will your father do to you?
8. What religion requires Burkas?
9. What religion forbids the education of women?
10. What religion sanctions the beheading of criminals?
11. What religion sanctions the cutting of the hand and opposing foot of a thief?
12. What religion sanctioned the murder of 3000 innocent Americans on 9-11? And before you moral equivalent advocates start in, The Chrsitian Crusades were in response to the invasion of Eastern Europe and Spain by Islam and the forced conversion or beheading of Europeans in those areas? the Pope and Europe decided it was time to fight back and push the Muslims out of Europe back to Palestine and North Africa. Remember El Cid and the Kings of Spain? Probably not, as most of you are historically ignorant.
Finally, shades of gray have got us to this juncture of history as it did Chamberlin with Hitler and now Kim Jong Pil, the Communist Chinese, the PLO, Hamas, and Ahmadinjab are doing the same to Obama. It is 1939 all over again and the equivalent of the invasion of Poland by the Nazis is only a matter of time.
Bill Pearson wrote: Better yet SCWB, i always am intrigued by these discussions and how God and prayer become a focal point. How quickly posters throw out the terms Socialism and Communism as if they are interchangeable and that liberals are all one in the same as Khrushchev and Marx. And of course, best of all is the fact that those on the right speak the truth and those on the left speak with forked tongues.
It should be noted i grew up in a Catholic household and one of the most troubling moments of my formative years was when i was told my grandfather, a stubborn Lutheran, would never be allowed in heaven. Purgatory was the best he could do.
That same kind of thinking took me through my high school years: the Catholic military school was perfect in getting me to see how it worked; play by their rules and life was good, be a free thinker and you would pay the price. Rigidity personified.
Now as an adult and i read these comments, i have to ask Chrisaz; which religion is the right one? The Soviet Union is filled with churches and people who worship in them. There are more Muslims on this earth than there are Christians and Lord knows they pray way more than we do. So, which God wins out in this battle for supremacy? Which God is good and which God is evil? Holy Mary Mother of God, what if you are praying to the wrong one?
Very little is ever as simple as black and white, there are always shades of gray. There is always reason to question, debate and discuss. More to follow but this is at least points to ponder.
Last edited on Tue Jun 30th, 2009 12:44 am by Retired AF Pilot
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Bill Pearson
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 08:47 pm |
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Better yet SCWB, i always am intrigued by these discussions and how God and prayer become a focal point. How quickly posters throw out the terms Socialism and Communism as if they are interchangeable and that liberals are all one in the same as Khrushchev and Marx. And of course, best of all is the fact that those on the right speak the truth and those on the left speak with forked tongues.
It should be noted i grew up in a Catholic household and one of the most troubling moments of my formative years was when i was told my grandfather, a stubborn Lutheran, would never be allowed in heaven. Purgatory was the best he could do.
That same kind of thinking took me through my high school years: the Catholic military school was perfect in getting me to see how it worked; play by their rules and life was good, be a free thinker and you would pay the price. Rigidity personified.
Now as an adult and i read these comments, i have to ask Chrisaz; which religion is the right one? The Soviet Union is filled with churches and people who worship in them. There are more Muslims on this earth than there are Christians and Lord knows they pray way more than we do. So, which God wins out in this battle for supremacy? Which God is good and which God is evil? Holy Mary Mother of God, what if you are praying to the wrong one?
Very little is ever as simple as black and white, there are always shades of gray. There is always reason to question, debate and discuss. More to follow but this is at least points to ponder.
Last edited on Mon Jun 29th, 2009 10:46 pm by Bill Pearson
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SunCityWestBill
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 07:36 pm |
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My post was not specifically directed -
It just seems so many people recently conveniently forget the past. They prefer to remember and speak of it as "The Golden Era" wherein things were done, exorbitant sums of money were spent, no bid contracts approved and no thought to how to pay the bills that were left. Now new people have moved into the house and found a lot of unpaid bills, some neighbors none too pleased and children that cannot read. The new people are trying, with good advisers as did the old occupants, to fix and make the situation better, but the people who used to live in the house are still upset and are loudly and constantly complaining about the garage door that does not close. They had 8 years to call a repairman and get it fixed and they would pay the bill, after they hit it with their car. They left it for the new owners of the house. Now they are complaining about the repairman's experience and schedule and they refuse to let anyone call him or possibly paying his bill, until they study the problem and the possible varied fixes. The door is still broken.
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christianaz
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 06:39 pm |
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Bill you misinterpeted what I said. I do speak out and also vote. If I get the chance to share things with others I do. What I am saying is that I saw my dad destroyed by letting this eat him apart. Some things are out of our control and then we need to pray and ask God to take the burden. I did not say I did nothing.
Those reading this should listen to retired AF pilot. He is right on and all he says is true. 
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SunCityWestBill
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 05:46 pm |
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OK, I guess we are going to hell in a handbag, attacked, economically ruined, leadership corrupt, morally bankrupt, Pbama does not know what he is doing, healthcare is awful, roads full of potholes, climate too hot, air quality bad, homeless everywhere, Recreation Center raising fees - again, illegal people coming into the country and taking all the jobs, all the jobs going out of the country, no one speaking good English, neighbor built a 7 foot fence, schools and education a disaster and except for New York, you cannot get a good bagel, cheesecake or a corned beef sandwich and the guy across the street has a weed in his lawn.
So what are you going to do about it? Pray?
You want to win the Lottery, God says do not leave it up to Him to handle it all for you - you have to do something - buy a ticket.
So you do your best and try and be optimistic. Do not always be into doom and gloom, but then again if you can preach that message how things are bad, but were so much better before *(provided people forget what actually did happen), well you can then justify why things are so bad and why you stand on the corner carrying that sign "The world is coming to an end", but for as smart as you make yourself out to be, you never say when it is going to end, but you sit home and think about it.
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christianaz
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 05:24 pm |
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To retired AF pilot
I commend you for speaking out and trying to get those Americans to see the truth.
I know in my heart all of this is true and because it upsets me so I do my thing in voting and leave the rest to God.
Our country has for many years not just the 8 everyone speaks of, been attacked from within just a Khrushchev stated many years ago that American would be destroyed from within. Our education system is how we have and are being destroyed from within.
I remember my dad who was a Lt. commander in the Navy talking to us about how communism will destroy this country. Create and breakdown the moral fiber of our country, destroy family values etc.
It has been going on for more years than I have been alive. In the 60's my dad talked about it but it was not apparent as it has been a slow erosion of our country. So subtle that Americans don't see it.
Hopefully you can help those that do not understand to believe. I believe it is Gods will that we do not have any control over it. All we can do is pray. To know in our hearts there is more to life than all of this and that each person before they die know Christ and accept him as their personal Savior and know that their souls being saved is really what matters in life. As we all will die.Either saved or unsaved. Nothing on this earth is more important than that as the fight between good and evil is going on in our country.
But bless you for trying. It upsets me so that again that I must turn to God and rest in him and know he is in control of all of this.
God bless you
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 06:02 am |
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Bill,
Krauthammer was writing for the Washington Post and doing spots on ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN long before he did Fox. And facts are facts. As far as giving a Marxist President a chance. Why? When what he is doing is going to be the ruination of all of us. His policies are the failed policies of Marx, Lenin, Trotsky, Chamberlin, the Vichy French, and so on. If I can help stop or slow him down, I will as will other good men of conscience.
And if you think I use the descriptive of Marxist for Obama too freely, read the following:
http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/06/obama_the_african_colonial.html
Last edited on Mon Jun 29th, 2009 06:02 am by Retired AF Pilot
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Bill Pearson
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Posted: Mon Jun 29th, 2009 05:01 am |
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Forgive me RAP for not putting a whole lot of credence in what a Fox network commentator has to say. I know, he has a boatload of credentials but he also has a bias that he has to spout or his viewers, readers and listeners wouldn't be one bit happy with him.
I am a big fan of giving everyone a chance to prove themselves. Seems to me both Reagan and Bush got that compromise you hesitate to think is important that allowed them to promote their agenda's. And i'll be the first to admit it wasn't without some kicking and screaming but old Chuck did say something i happen to think is accurate: I'll judge Obama based on what he does, not what he says; but i will give him time to either succeed or fail before i cast that judgment.
This silly criticism that he's ruined the country in the past 5 months is laughable. He inherited one of the most messed up economy's a newly seated president has ever seen. Righting it's course will take time and until he proves to be a bigger mistake than the last president, i'll give him that time.
Of more concern to me is what has happened to this country and the workers in it. The multi-national corporations have all but destroyed any sense of commitment to anything other than making billions. They do it any cost and they reward themselves with grossly inflated salaries all while their employees are kicked to the streets.
Henry Ford said it all years ago; if the workers can't buy the cars they produce, there is no point in making them. It is such a simple insight and somehow over the years we lost sight of that . And that my friend is where i struggle with the right. They have supported those folks who had it all and still wanted more. When is enough enough in this country? Or maybe the better question is; is too much ever too much?
Last edited on Mon Jun 29th, 2009 05:03 am by Bill Pearson
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 11:33 pm |
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A summation of a speech by Charles Krauthammer:
1. Mr. Obama is a very intellectual, charming individual. He is not to be underestimated. He is a 'cool customer' who doesn't show his emotions. It's very hard to know what's 'behind the mask'. Taking down the Clinton dynasty by a political neophyte was an amazing accomplishment. The Clintons still do not understand what hit them. Obama was in the perfect place at the perfect time.
2. Obama has political skills comparable to Reagan & Clinton. He has a way of making you think he's on your side, agreeing w/ your position, while doing the opposite. Pay no attn. to what he SAYS; rather, watch what he DOES!
3. Obama has a ruthless quest for power. He did not come to Washington to make something out of himself, but rather to change everything, incl. dismantling capitalism. He can't be straightforward on his ambitions, as the public would not go along.. He has a heavy hand, & wants to level the playing field' w/ income redistribution & punishment of the achievers of society. He would like to model the USA to Great Britain or Canada .
4. His 3 main goals are to control ENERGY, PUBLIC EDUCATION, & NAT'L HEALTHCARE by the Fed. govt. He doesn't care about the auto or financial services industries, but got them as an early bonus. The cap & trade will add costs to everything & stifle growth. Paying for FREE college education is his goal. Most scary is healthcare program, because if you make it FREE & add 46,000,000 people to a Medicare-type single-payer system, the costs will go thru the roof. The only way to control costs is w/ massive RATIONING of services, like in Canada . God forbid.
5. He's surrounded himself w/ mostly far-left academic types. No one around him has ever run even a candy store. But they're going to try & run the auto, financial, banking & other industries. This obviously can't work in the long run. Obama's not a socialist; rather a far-left secular progressive bent on nothing short of revolution. He ran as a moderate, but will govern from the hard left. Again, watch what he does, not what he says.
6. Obama doesn't really see himself as President of the USA , more as a ruler over the world. He sees himself above it all, trying to orchestrate & coordinate various countries & their agendas. He sees moral equivalency in all cultures. His apology tour in Germany & England was a prime example of how he sees America , as an imperialist nation that has been arrogant, rather than a great noble nation that has at times made errors. This is the 1st President ever who has chastised our allies & appeased our enemies!
7. He's now handing out goodies. He hopes that the bill (& pain) will not 'come due' until after he's reelected in 2012. He'd like to blame all problems on Bush from the past, & hopefully his successor in the future. He has a huge ego, & Mr. Krauthammer believes he is a narcissist.
8. Republicans are in the wilderness for a while, but will emerge strong. We're 'pining' for another Reagan, but there'll never be another like him. He believes Mitt Romney, Tim Pawlenty & Bobby Jindahl (except for his terrible speech in Feb.) are the future of the party. Newt Gingrich is brilliant, but has baggage. Sarah Palin is sincere & intelligent, but needs to really be seriously boning up on facts & info if she's to be a serious candidate in the future. We need to return to the party of lower taxes, smaller govt., personal responsibility, strong nat'l defense, & states' rights.
9. The current level of spending is irresponsible & outrageous. We're spending trillions that we don't have. This could lead to hyper inflation, depression or worse. No country has ever spent themselves into prosperity. The media is giving Obama, Reid & Pelosi a pass because they love their agenda. But eventually the bill will come due & people will realize the huge bailouts didn't work, nor will the stimulus pkg. These were trillion-dollar payoffs to Obama's allies, unions & the Congress to placate the left, so he can get support for #4 above.
10. The election was over in mid-Sept. when Lehman brothers failed. Fear & panic swept in, we had an unpopular President, & the war was grinding on indefinitely w/o a clear outcome. The people are in pain, & the mantra of 'change' caused people to act emotionally. Any Dem would have won this election; it was surprising it was as close as it was.
11. In 2012, if the unemployment rate is over 10%, Republicans will be swept back into power. If it's under 8%, the Dems continue to roll. If it's between 8-10%, it'll be a dogfight. It'll all be about the economy. I hope this gets you really thinking about what's happening in Washington & Congress. There's a left-wing revolution going on, according to Krauthammer, & he encourages us to keep the faith & join the loyal resistance. The work will be hard, but we're right on most issues & can reclaim our country, before it's far too late.
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Bill Pearson
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 11:05 pm |
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Obviously you are articulate and able to make your points RAP; where you loose me is when you start throwing around the terms like Marxist and Socialist and the myriad of others the right uses to discredit the left. I have had this debate a hundred times and frankly it becomes boring.
President Bush had 8 years and when he left office the country was in a shambles. Was he solely to blame? No, but as we have said before, the president ultimately lives and dies with the outcomes during his years in office.
And that is where i get crazed by those on the right who have been throwing grenades (for all of you in love with the military industrial complex...by the way, does anyone remember what Ike said about it?) at Obama since the day he took office. Seems to me like you ought to give him a chance to fail before you proclaim him a failure.
Lastly, there was a time in this country when politicians on both sides of aisle were concerned about the country. While elections were important, they were not the end all be all. There are few statesmen left in this country, there are way too many politicians bought and paid for by the machines behind them and when they say jump, the only question is how high. That's a shame for the country and all of us living here.
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 09:01 pm |
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To SCW Bill,
Happiness and contentment have nothing to do with it. An undying search and love of the truth drives me.
Last edited on Sun Jun 28th, 2009 09:02 pm by Retired AF Pilot
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 09:00 pm |
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Bill,
I make no comparisons of President Bush to Reagan of a favorable kind except for keeping the nation safe, cutting taxes, and his genuine support and love of the military, especially the GI. He made two to three trips a week during his entire administration to Bethesada and Walter Reed with the First Lady to thank the wounded and their families personally. He never shirked from his responsibility for their wounds in one bit. He and the First Lady prayed and talked with the wounded and their loved ones. Don't believe me, remember Cindy Sheehan. Her ex husband rebuked her for tarnishing Casey's memory and acting like an ass.
But, I parted company with him on immigration and deficit spending and the bailout. Those were and are wrong and their legacy will be felt adversely for decades. He gave an unlimited credit card to the Marxist that is in the White House. Heaven help us.
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Bill Pearson
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 08:51 pm |
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I find this discussion interesting. While i admit i am a bleeding heart liberal, i also grow weary of the debate of who is to blame. The system itself is rampant with a political process where the players ultimately have to be paid back. The money guys play both sides of the street and regardless of who is in office, the check comes due. The only difference is who is on the receiving end and how much they get.
I gotta tell you Ret AF Pilot, i do find your comparison of Bush to Reagan curious. I think ultra conservative George Buchanan may take exception to that position. In his book Where The Right Went Wrong he was very pointed as to the mistakes Bush made and how he differed from Reagan.
Where i really grow tired of this debate is when we start throwing the labels around. It becomes the lazy man's way to brand someone and avoid the discussion and dealing with facts.
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SunCityWestBill
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 07:54 pm |
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If you are happy and content with your thinking and response, then no one will convince you otherwise.
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 07:46 pm |
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President Bush did not unilaterally decide to go into Iraq to take out a radical regime and Saddam Hussein, If I remember right Saddam ignored International Law, refused 17 UN demands to give up his nuclear research and weapons of mass destruction (which he had used nerve and mustard gas against his own people several times) and was given the chance to disarm over a 1 year period, but refused to let in UN inspectors.
No, President Bush went to Congress and the UN over 17 months and made his case for holding Iraq to the letter of International Law and both the UN and Congress (twice) gave him (President Bush) clearance to make Saddam obey the law. After our US Congress voted again (one month before) to go into Iraq (almost all Democrats voted yes, to include Mrs. Clinton and Senator Kerry to name two) only then did President Bush give Saddam a deadline and when Saddam ignored it, the US, Great Britain, Australia, and others went in.
Prior to that the Russian, Iranians, and Syrians moved all the nuclear, gas, and biological materials out to Syrian and Iran. Look it up.
So, put that in your computer and congitate on those facts.
PS NCLB is working much to almost all educator's amazement to include the author, Senator Kennedy. Accountability is a wondrous thing.
4400 servicemembers dead over 6 years is less than the training death rate when I was on active. In fact during WWII, 6000 plus died on Normandy beaches in one day, 800 dead in one night training for D-Day, 5000 airmen dead a year in stateside training accidents from 1942 to 1945, 24,500 drunk driving dead a year today.
I am not lessening the deaths of our brave servicemembers, but they have kept us safe since 911. But, now the President is reducing the military budget by 25% and cutting missile defense by 1.5 billion just we have a nuclear missile threat from North Korea. Go figure that reality.
The next 911 is going to be worse than the last because of this President's lack of common sense.
Last edited on Sun Jun 28th, 2009 07:53 pm by Retired AF Pilot
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SunCityWestBill
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 06:25 pm |
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"Now, it is considered wrong to criticize a President that has violated his oath of office in his moves to take over the banks, Wallstreet, Automobile companies, the health care industry, and more."
But see it is ok to put us in a war where thousands of our service people were killed because he wanted to with no evidence and Cheney over at the CIA trying to convince them to give them something to base the invasion on - which they could not.
Oh, I forget, we are supposed to forget that and get on with the present. Of course the deficiet that was left us - forget that too, and the growing of the administration - forget that too, the failure of "no child left behind - forget that too, the deregulation of the banks - forget that too. seems we have to forget a lot.
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christianaz
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 05:21 pm |
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To retired AF pilot
You are so right.
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 04:38 pm |
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"Compassionate Conservatism" based on Jesus' message is not the origin of the problems we have today. If we truly did as the Savior asked, we would be finally at peace and most would be happy. Some won't though, because they hate Christ and do not want to held accountable to a loving and just God.
It is good men letting Liberals define the terms of the argument and not confronting Liberalism for the lie it is. It was not Republicans or Conservatives that continue the unending harangue that we experienced over the last 8 years. It was Liberal Democrats and the Mainstream Media that kept up the constant attacks that poisoned the public discourse.
Now, it is considered wrong to criticize a President that has violated his oath of office in his moves to take over the banks, Wallstreet, Automobile companies, the health care industry, and more.
We are becoming like the former Soviet Union with rationed everything which results in nothing.
Think about it.
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SunCityWestBill
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 04:07 pm |
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During the Presidential Candidates debate, the subjects were all asked the question -not quoted exactly - "Who is the person you admire most". All but one answered a parent, government figure or teacher - George Bush answered "Jesus Christ" and with the gasp from the audience, the Conservatives in attendence knew they had "Their Leader".
The "Compassionate 'Christian' Conservatism" as "preached" by George Bush, Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell and Karl Rove, to mention a few, has brought us what we see, hear and experience to this day. The disharmony, cynicism and trashing of any fellow man is considered "fair game" against any idea, ideology or person not in agreement with them. The intense prejudging and abrogation of personal responsibility and fear to accept personal accountability is not a trend more than about 10 years old. I am not saying it did not exist before, but the intensity and self righteousness did not. It is not a Republican, Democrat, Independent or Green Party thing, but it is overwrought religious Conservatives not getting what they see as their "Divine Right".
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 06:55 am |
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Remember 1994 and the "Contract with America." Remember Ronald Reagan and his triumph over Liberalism, Communism, and the 25 years of economic rejuvenation that sprung from his bringing back smaller government, less taxes, and free markets. You either forgot that or never learned it. That is why you are ignorant and pitiful. Reagan Conservatism will rise again and America will be glad to reject your intolerance.
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Sun City Watch
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 05:53 am |
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You are the clueless and ignorant one and I am done with you. Pull the covers over your head, tomorrow will prove you wrong. AMF
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 05:27 am |
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You are a prime example of what is wrong today with many Americans and that is ignorance disguised as compassion but which is really intolerance. Yes, the most expensive thing in the United States is ignorance and you have it in spades. I really don't believe you were ever a Republican or a Conservative or you wouldn't be the ignorant fool you are now.
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Sun City Watch
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 04:29 am |
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You can never reach out it seems, so be it! Put that somewhere and do what you want with it! Your party, or the GOP, is a party of the past.
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 02:24 am |
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Conservatives have to reach out? What a joke and a double standard. And what did it get the Republican party other than out of control of Congress and the White House. The conventional wisdom is that Conservatives must reach out and compromise. But ask a Liberal to reach out and compromise or admit that their ideas are shot full of holes and one risks being ridiculed as being too rigid or behind the times or evil in intent.
Has it ever dawned on you that what you ask for has been done and never worked? Republican Presidents have reached out as well as the party to the other side and got stiffed in return.
I for one refuse to compromise my principles. If anyone, doesn't matter race, creed, color, national origin, sex, etc., agrees with Reagan Conservatism then they are my ally. But, anyone that seeks to practice Marxism, Socialism, etc., then I will oppose them with ever fiber of my will.
Put that in your pipe and smoke it.
The best thing for the USA is go back to the original intent of Founders and their Constitution that they gave us. And it ain't a living breathing document subject to the whims of Liberals. Read the Federalist and Anti-Federalist papers to learn that one.
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Sun City Watch
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Posted: Sun Jun 28th, 2009 12:38 am |
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I think you never look beyond the skin color although you and the GOP think you do. You are beyond hope! The GOP is in a sad state because of people like you. Hopefully, your party will see the light and reach out. That is not the case currently. The issue is not liberalism, that is only a scare word from your base. You should look at your base and ask, Is this the future of my party?
If you think it is, you are making a big mistake!
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 11:48 pm |
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Sir, you couldn't be more wrong. But when were you ever right. When you learn to ignore the color of one's skin and other superficial surface features and concentrate only on the character of the person, you will truly be wise. But, that is hoping for too much from the likes of you and other Liberals.
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Sun City Watch
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 06:50 pm |
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Wrong! Not obsessed at all but see reality unlike you who never leaves Sun City.
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 02:23 pm |
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You are obsessed with race without a doubt. I am only concerned with the content of one's character and the actions that proceed out of that condition. Race means nothing if one is a scoundrel or one that seeks to tell others how to run their lives. Think about it.
Your obession with race and the demand for diversity denies one and all the greatest freedom that this nation was formed on, that being the freedom to associate with those one chooses to do so. Notice, I did not say, to exclude. But, if you take your obsession with race and diversity to its logical end, no one could have the freedom to choose one's friends.
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Sun City Watch
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 06:52 am |
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No I am not but unless you never leave Sun City and Arizona, there are Black, Yellow, and many shades of Brown out there in the United States. This is not a WHITE country any longer and should open your eyes and ears.
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 06:16 am |
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You are obviously preoccupied to the point of obsession with race. Think about it.
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Sun City Watch
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 04:17 am |
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I am very happy and more than I can say for the GOP! Perhaps it is time for a new re birthed GOP or real Conservative party? Certainly, that is not we have witnessed lately.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0508/10464.html GOP fails to recruit minorities
Stelle is a puppet of the "white southern base".
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 03:45 am |
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You are at least a RINO, but the worst a disingenuous Liberal that is afraid to admit you are one. So, you resort to obsfucation and dissembling. How droll and boring. You were never a conservative or you would be proud of Michael Steele. But, alas you are what you are.
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Sun City Watch
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 01:45 am |
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Did you answer the question and also follow the links? I doubt it! I only saw one face of color in the photo.
For your information, I am a dis-satisfied conservative that has voted Democratic and happy about doing it because the GOP has lost it's way in recent years. Can't you see the facts and admit that? If you can not, then you are blind and lost to a party that may be lost as well.
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 01:09 am |
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Now your true colors come out. You are a rabid liberal and any black or person of color that are conservative do not count in your world. They are Uncle Tom's or Aunt Tomasinas as far as you are concerned and a sellout to their race. How racist and low.
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Sun City Watch
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 12:56 am |
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Steele is a joke! The party is lead by Rush and Newt and if you don't see that you are pathetic and blind. Watt and Rice are gone and I would still like to list some others of color in elected national positions.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0508/10464.html GOP fails to recruit minorities
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2009/03/01/rnc_chairman_plans_turnaround_for_battered_party/ RNC chairman plans turnaround for battered party
How many faces of color other than Mr. Steele?
Attachment: Steele.jpg (Downloaded 144 times) Last edited on Sat Jun 27th, 2009 01:08 am by Sun City Watch
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Sat Jun 27th, 2009 12:34 am |
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If you did not see the individuals I mentioned then you are pathetic.
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Sun City Watch
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Posted: Fri Jun 26th, 2009 11:11 pm |
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Color sets or black and white, little or no faces of color in the GOP. Is that the reason they are the true minority party?
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Fri Jun 26th, 2009 05:13 am |
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You obviously need new glasses or ones that are not tinted rose colored. I suggest you get clear ones that allow you to see colors.
Or better yet for both of you, get rid of your Black & White RCA television sets and get a 15 flat screen HDTV color TV at Best Buy. Yes, that's it, that's the ticket. Might help see the real McCoy and you won't miss those Kodak moments.
Argentina, how about former Governors Blagoevich and Spitzer and their problems as well as the present NY Governor Patterson and his little trysts.
Last edited on Fri Jun 26th, 2009 05:47 am by Retired AF Pilot
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Senior Moment
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Posted: Fri Jun 26th, 2009 03:42 am |
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But answer his/her question, where were the faces of color? I can't remember seeing any.
Ho Hum Hum! The GOP needs a face lift in the worst way. Were you flying to Argentina lately?
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Fri Jun 26th, 2009 12:56 am |
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Let's see, as I reject the racist premise of your question, Michael Steele (new leader of the Republican Party) JC Watt, former congressman from Oklahoma, Secretary of State Condolezza Rice, and I could go on, but what difference to a Nimrod such as you would it make. Any person (of color) of conservative persuasion is an anathema to you. They obviously are Uncle or Aunt Toms'.
Ho Hum.
Alberto Gonzalez, Michelle Malkin, Secretary of Transportation Elaine Chu, Star Parker, Tom Sowell, come to mind. But I forgot, if they aren't black and liberal, they don't count.
Last edited on Fri Jun 26th, 2009 01:06 am by Retired AF Pilot
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Sun City Watch
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Posted: Thu Jun 25th, 2009 10:51 pm |
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Where were faces of color at the last GOP convention? All I remember seeing were WHITE faces. I see "unabashed balderdash" in you post.
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Retired AF Pilot
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Posted: Thu Jun 25th, 2009 07:10 pm |
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This is complete unabashed balderdash.
Facts:
Republicans were born out of the ashes of the Whig Party that refused to address the immorality of slavery. Because of the Republican party, 600,000 Americans and Abraham Lincoln paid with their lives restoring God Given Freedom to the black man.
Republicans (at the request of LBJ) championed and passed the Voter's Rights Act of 1965 and the Civil Rights Act of 1964 over the objections of Democrats such as Senators Byrd, Fulbright, and Gore (AlGore's father). LBJ could not get his own party to support him on these laws.
Republicans gave us the "All Volunteer Force" and ended the draft. Democrats gave us the attacks on the military from VietNam and deserted the South Vietnamese to the Communist invasion from North Vietnam over the objections of President Ford. The Democrat Congress refused to fund the US Military action to defend the South in 1975 and we watched the murder and assassination of 1 million South Vietnamese with the fall of Saigon and the "Killing Fields" of Cambodia and subsequent death of 2 million Cambodians from Pol Pot due to the cowardice of Democrats.
A Democrat (Jimmy Carter) gave the world the modern terrorist state of Iran when he refused to support the Shah of Iran and allowed the butcher Ayotollah Khomeini to come back to Iran, take away women's rights, and assassinate his political and military opposition. Result: 1984 Marine Barracks (240 dead), two US embassies bombed (hundreds dead), the US Cole, (20 plus dead), Khobar Towers (19 dead), the 1979 hostage crisis of 440 plus days in Tehran, all because Jimmy Carter refused to deal forcefully with Khomeini. Do you remember the 40 plus US hostages after our embassy was invaded illegally by the Iranians. Remember all embassies are sovereign territory of the nation occupying them. The only way the hostages were released was the election of Ronald Reagan and the Iranian's realization that he would not accept their terrorism and hold them accountable by action not word. Former Secretary of State for Clinton, Warren Christopher, (Democrat) admitted as much when he told the Iranians that Reagan would make them regret their illegal acts when Christopher negotiated with the Iranian terrorists for Carter.
Republicans were the first to appoint women and blacks to cabinet positions, courts, and other government positions, but get no credit because these minorities are conservative in their politics. Remember Colin Powell, Condolezza Rice, Clarence Thomas, etc.
I refuse to accept the premise of your obviously ignorant rant on alleged Republican racism. You can put it where the sun don't shine. The real home of racism is the Democrat party because race is how Democrats make all their decisions. I could care less about the race of an individual. I do care about their character and actions.
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