Newszap Forums Home
 Search       Members   Calendar   Help   Home 
Search by username
Not logged in - Login | Register 

Music in the Lake Forest schools
 
 New Topic   Reply   Print 
AuthorPost
Bluesman
Member


Joined: Thu Mar 1st, 2007
Location: Delaware USA
Posts: 3325
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Thu Oct 23rd, 2008 03:16 pm
 Quote  Reply 
LostinHarrington wrote: As an aside, parents and children keep forgetting that the Constitution was written for adults, not children.  Children these days still do not have the right to be heard until questioned. 

Visit a classroom at Lake, and you will find that the children (yours and mine) feel they have the right to be heard and openly debate or challenge educators all the time.  The "me" generation has nurtured a group of spoiled immature kids who believe they should be treated as adults, yet do not wish to act like adults. The parents have caused this problem by constantly defending their children's poor performance or actions. 

It is the parents job to stand up for the interest of the students - as long as those interests are valid.  Get the community together, take them to school during and event and protest.  Make signs calling for the coaches resignation, the school board, the principles, the whole kit-and-kaboodle.  Go "en-mass" and make sure the press is there.  Large numbers will be heard over a few lone voices in the wilderness.

Absolutely correct and it is in all school districts in every state. My wife is a full time teacher and I substitute. I can't tell you the number of times I have heard:

"don't you get in my face"

" you can't tell me what to do, you aren't my father"

"NO I don't have to do that"

"go ahead punish me my parents will come in and complain and get me off"

 (BTW those kids parents usually do come in and get their kids off, they are enablers)
 


"GO F*%$ yourself"

 

My wife has heard all the same and then some, she has also been physically assaulted twice, both students were arrested and charged with assault and battery. One was expelled from school the other student (who was a star athlete and who's parents were wealthy did not.)

The student was so dumb he thought the Kentuckey Derby was a hat (honest to God he gave that as an answer on his test) yet teachers had to give him passing grades. When my wife failed him on his quarterly exam the student lost it and shoved her into the corner of the classroom, mind you he was 6' 4" 255 pounds my wife is 5'0" and a man never tells his wifes weight or age...:D

The administration caved to the parents threats of a lawsuit and the student wasn't expelled. Obviously this sends a dangerous message to other students, and it is out of control. Personally I think any student who assaults a teacher should be expelled period.

LostinHarrington
Member
 

Joined: Sun Jul 13th, 2008
Location:  
Posts: 15
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Thu Oct 23rd, 2008 02:29 pm
 Quote  Reply 
As an aside, parents and children keep forgetting that the Constitution was written for adults, not children.  Children these days still do not have the right to be heard until questioned. 

Visit a classroom at Lake, and you will find that the children (yours and mine) feel they have the right to be heard and openly debate or challenge educators all the time.  The "me" generation has nurtured a group of spoiled immature kids who believe they should be treated as adults, yet do not wish to act like adults. The parents have caused this problem by constantly defending their children's poor performance or actions. 

It is the parents job to stand up for the interest of the students - as long as those interests are valid.  Get the community together, take them to school during and event and protest.  Make signs calling for the coaches resignation, the school board, the principles, the whole kit-and-kaboodle.  Go "en-mass" and make sure the press is there.  Large numbers will be heard over a few lone voices in the wilderness.

double deuce
Member


Joined: Sun Mar 16th, 2008
Location: Delaware USA
Posts: 122
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Thu Oct 23rd, 2008 11:33 am
 Quote  Reply 
does anyone see resemblances with other posts about anything within lake forest?  it is pretty obvious that complaints are voiced to administraion but they do nothing.  maybe there should be an administrator sit with the band one nite, and another tag along with the football team.  act as a student, blend in, and see for themselves what goes on.  but then again, they probably wouldn't notice anything wrong.  they only see what they want.

Bluesman
Member


Joined: Thu Mar 1st, 2007
Location: Delaware USA
Posts: 3325
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Thu Oct 23rd, 2008 11:28 am
 Quote  Reply 
Mom as an outsider just observing comments posted that seems to be what goes on with everything at LF. Some of the teachers and staff themselves are disgusted with issues falling on deaf ears at the adminstrative level.

Mom4LF
Member
 

Joined: Wed Oct 22nd, 2008
Location:  
Posts: 9
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Thu Oct 23rd, 2008 02:55 am
 Quote  Reply 
your right I agree it is just hard to hear most of the people actually working for the school sort of passing the buck and making all of the problems sound as if it falls on the kids shoulders. No one at the school seems to want to really look at the root of everything going on. So much has happened I can't explain why she is still there but hopefully it will change. Just to be very clear I think she is a nice lady but the way she handles the band is insane, and it would be a shame to see it fail because she can't take some direction from assistants who tried to help. For the record she did run the one assistant from band camp off one other assistant is still there as she has been for many years.

Bluesman
Member


Joined: Thu Mar 1st, 2007
Location: Delaware USA
Posts: 3325
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Wed Oct 22nd, 2008 10:59 pm
 Quote  Reply 
Mom4LF wrote: yes she is making comments and I have told the people in charge...why should these kids respect someone if they don't like her actions.....sometimes they may not go about things the right way but they have a voice and should be heard and should feel as though the school is looking out for their best interests. Many people feel the same way I do so you need to see it from our veiwI do see it from your view, but they should still be respectful of this person if for  nothing else because she is an adult. To do otherwise only reduces them to the same level as she is apparently acting.

Last edited on Wed Oct 22nd, 2008 10:59 pm by Bluesman

Mom4LF
Member
 

Joined: Wed Oct 22nd, 2008
Location:  
Posts: 9
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Wed Oct 22nd, 2008 10:23 pm
 Quote  Reply 
yes she is making comments and I have told the people in charge...why should these kids respect someone if they don't like her actions.....sometimes they may not go about things the right way but they have a voice and should be heard and should feel as though the school is looking out for their best interests. Many people feel the same way I do so you need to see it from our veiw

Bluesman
Member


Joined: Thu Mar 1st, 2007
Location: Delaware USA
Posts: 3325
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Wed Oct 22nd, 2008 09:52 pm
 Quote  Reply 
sickandtiredofit wrote: OMG this is ridiculous!  How about if I start posting personal things on here about you?  Would you like that?  Is this bordering on slander?  Be careful what you are saying or you could find yourself in hot water!  I've been around Lake Forest School District for a few years.  If she is as bad as you say she is then she will be dismissed.  If she is not dismissed then they must not have any grounds to do so and she is doing her job.  If she is doing her job she should get the support of every parent to make it work.  The negative criticism surrounding this will doing nothing but giving off bad vibes and make the situation worse.  Grow up and act your age not the students ages.

Is this bordering on slander? No actually the written word is libel.

There isn't anything that has been posted that is close to libel.  If this teacher is making derogatory and inappropriate comments to students it should be addressed.

 

sickandtiredofit
Member
 

Joined: Wed Oct 22nd, 2008
Location:  
Posts: 6
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Wed Oct 22nd, 2008 08:45 pm
 Quote  Reply 
OMG this is ridiculous!  How about if I start posting personal things on here about you?  Would you like that?  Is this bordering on slander?  Be careful what you are saying or you could find yourself in hot water!  I've been around Lake Forest School District for a few years.  If she is as bad as you say she is then she will be dismissed.  If she is not dismissed then they must not have any grounds to do so and she is doing her job.  If she is doing her job she should get the support of every parent to make it work.  The negative criticism surrounding this will doing nothing but giving off bad vibes and make the situation worse.  Grow up and act your age not the students ages.

imjeffsfan
Member
 

Joined: Thu May 10th, 2007
Location:  
Posts: 44
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Wed Oct 22nd, 2008 08:23 pm
 Quote  Reply 
Trust me too.  I have been around there quite a bit with my kids.  I've seen how the kids are treated.  I've also seen the way she is treated.  To get respect it has to be given first. 

Mom4LF
Member
 

Joined: Wed Oct 22nd, 2008
Location:  
Posts: 9
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Wed Oct 22nd, 2008 07:41 pm
 Quote  Reply 
I resent someone stating that the kids are not dedicated. If you had to put up with the commments from that director and had to listen to her nonsense all the time you would understand. The assistant doesn't treat the kids the way the main director does. Trust me....I help with the band and know first hand what she says to the students and she makes them feel very uncomfortable at times. She isn't the only one to blame for the band having problems, but now those kids need someone who is willing to turn it around for them and I know they would be willing to work with them. They do not get the feed back from her they need, she says things to them that are completly inappropriate, she won't take anyones advice about how to make the band better. Honestly she has ruined my kids time at band. Some complained about Mr. Smith but I would love to have him back

I Teach
Member
 

Joined: Fri Nov 4th, 2005
Location:  
Posts: 65
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Wed Oct 22nd, 2008 04:24 am
 Quote  Reply 
Congratulations to Mr. Mark Teesdale, Delaware Teacher of the Year!

imjeffsfan
Member
 

Joined: Thu May 10th, 2007
Location:  
Posts: 44
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Tue Oct 21st, 2008 01:18 pm
 Quote  Reply 
Run off the assistant band director?  She is still there.

As far as the show on Friday nights, have you listened to it?  I have and it is actually good.   From my understanding their scores are only 1 point behind so with some hard work and dedication they have room for improvement.

myboysmom78
Member
 

Joined: Tue Aug 12th, 2008
Location:  
Posts: 6
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Tue Oct 21st, 2008 12:10 pm
 Quote  Reply 
An even bigger problem is that the current high school director is terrible and the kids don't respect her.  She has run off a wonderful assistant director because of her attitude and lack of experience.  Last year half of the band quit because of the director and it has just gotten worse since then but the administration isn't listening to the kids, parents or apparently, the show on Friday nights.  I know a band member and I've heard what their scores are each week...it's not good. 

As far as a marching band at Chipman, that is something I've said all along.  However, when the kids went from that marching band to the high school band, they still had to relearn everything about marching.  It was a completely different style of marching.  The only thing that really helped was knowing how to play while you were moving. 

The football team is a disgrace as well! I don't know what happened, but Lake Forest used to be a formidable opponent all the way around and these days they are a mess.  Lake Forest is not the school it used to be and I'm grateful my children are no longer in the district. 

Last edited on Tue Oct 21st, 2008 12:12 pm by myboysmom78

imjeffsfan
Member
 

Joined: Thu May 10th, 2007
Location:  
Posts: 44
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Tue Oct 21st, 2008 03:27 am
 Quote  Reply 
Part of their problem is the lack of dedication from the current students.  Another part of their problem is their is no longer a band at Chipman.  Can anyone tell why?  I can - it's because the past two (at least) band directors at Chipman were given the option and they decided that they didn't have time for marching band.  Bring back the Chipman band and it will be a true reflection on the high school band.  The kids will be learning what they need to along the way.  Did you know that the music selection that they are currently playing is a very hard selection?  The band is bringing home scores almost as good as last years scores.  As far as winning seasons - if it were only about winning then the football team wouldn't be playing either.  I could mention several other teams at Lake that would be folded if it was only about winning. 

If Dr. Curry was truly interested in music he would listen to this post and have a marching band at Chipman like their used to be. 

myboysmom78
Member
 

Joined: Tue Aug 12th, 2008
Location:  
Posts: 6
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Wed Oct 8th, 2008 05:59 pm
 Quote  Reply 
I was fortunate enough to have the good years as well.  :)  We had a great program in elementary, middle school was so-so (the Apache years), and high school was great too.  Unfortunately the administration can't seem to find a high school director worth the money they are paying them since Dale Mann left to go to Milford. 

LFMOM
Member
 

Joined: Mon Mar 13th, 2006
Location:  
Posts: 48
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Wed Oct 8th, 2008 01:48 pm
 Quote  Reply 
LF North had a great music program/teacher when my 4 kids were there in the 90's. The teacher had a piano in the room and taught the kids the keys and notes. They bought the little flute like instruments(recorders) and the kids learned to play them. They learned to read basic music notes. They learned the scales. And they put on FANTASTIC musical programs at the holidays. My kids bought and were taught their first instruments in 5th grade and played in 6th thru 8th at WTC. Mrs. Simms gave them an excellent musical education. She gave them a love of music that they still carry with them.

myboysmom78
Member
 

Joined: Tue Aug 12th, 2008
Location:  
Posts: 6
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Tue Oct 7th, 2008 12:26 pm
 Quote  Reply 
Does anyone else find it funny that Dr. Curry is claiming to be so into the music program, yet the current band director at the high school is terrible?  There have been many complaints by students and parents, a lot of kids quit band because of her, and (sorry kids!) the band is no longer a competitive band. 

landerson
Member
 

Joined: Wed Apr 19th, 2006
Location:  
Posts: 143
Status:  Offline
 Posted: Mon Oct 6th, 2008 09:04 pm
 Quote  Reply 


Music in the Lake Forest schools



By Dr. Daniel D. Curry



Superintendent
Lake Forest School District



First, a disclaimer — I have a strong bias for this subject due to my personal experience. Music has always been a part of my life. I was only nine years old when I agreed to take accordion lessons (even though I didn’t know what an accordion looked like). Over the years I’ve fooled around with various guitars, banjos and a few odd instruments.



My family always sang in church. On long trips in the car we could sing four part harmony to lots of my parents’ favorite old songs. I sang tenor in touring choirs in high school and college and played major roles in various college and community musical productions. A few years ago I joined the local barbershop chorus, a fun hobby that has been suspended for awhile due to the time commitment.



So, I’m a big fan of school music programs.



In 2003, I learned the Lake Forest music program included general music for all, plus band and chorus through 6th grade. I was also surprised to learn that only instrumental music instruction was offered after 6th grade. No general music at the middle school. No opportunity to sing on a regular basis at the middle or high school. Some could remember when they had a choir at LFHS, but none could remember when or why that stopped.



When enrollment earns additional positions, we give our principals great discretion in determining just what kinds of teachers need to be hired. State accountability puts pressure on them to hire teachers who have the better chance of increasing student achievement in reading and math. It is hard to expand opportunities in music education in this kind of environment. But, we are expanding anyway, a little at a time.



The Lake Forest Board of Education has established a goal that aims for increasing student participation in the arts and in extra-curricular activities. In our most recent referendum, we approved fine arts additions to Lake Forest High School that include specialized instructional spaces for both band and chorus. We’d like to see our high school band grow and we’d like to see our high school students get the opportunity to take chorus as an elective. Maybe someday we could have a select show choir.



With the relocation of the sixth grade to the middle school we have made time for a 6th grade chorus to have class during the school day. We hope this is the seed that will lead to elective chorus classes for all students at all grade levels in the future.



Why support such expansions? How can you teach a canary not to sing?



I believe that all children have music inside of them. They are like canaries and they need to sing. Even those who can’t carry a tune in a bucket, need to sing, play a horn or bang on a drum. Through music, children can learn to express themselves. They can learn history. They can learn about other cultures. Than can learn to sing in different languages. They learn self confidence. They learn to be comfortable in front of others. They learn that a magical musical sound can come from a lot of different parts working together. Most of all, they can carry their voice and the songs they learn with them for the rest of their lives.



I don’t even have room here to go into the academic benefits of learning to read music — the vocabulary, the fluency, the rhythm, the understanding! Those who learn to read music, rarely struggle with reading.


In this era of tight state budgets and No Child Left Behind, music has often been a target for cut backs. We will really challenge ourselves if we are to expand musical opportunities in this kind of environment. I think it would be worth it.


 Current time is 11:07 pm



Click here to read our Policies & Disclaimers.

Powered by WowBB 1.7 - Copyright © 2003-2006 Aycan Gulez
Page processed in 0.2818 seconds (18% database + 82% PHP). 20 queries executed.