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Born Country
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Posted: Sun May 17th, 2009 02:40 am |
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The administration appears to accept that there is no alternative, therefore they seem to have quit trying. Believing that you "can't" is a great way to ensure that you won't. I don't surround myself with that type of limited thinking b/c it's contagious. How disappointing that our Gov. appears not to understand such a key component of good leadership. 
Disgusted, don't believe it's not possible! Quitting is not the answer right now. Teach. Speak out. Be one of the many leaders who must emerge in the vaccuum created by this limited thinker. Doing our best to the very end (when we get him to see the light or out of office) is the least we can do to know that we are not the ones who stood by and allowed a bully to harm others while looking away.
Disgusted wrote:
PtG, I'm also offended. But, with the projected budget deficit at $800 million and apparently growing, I think we'll be fortunate to get our pay cut by only 8%. Unless economics turn fast, I expect that to worsen.
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Born Country
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Posted: Sun May 17th, 2009 01:46 am |
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Pay cuts are wrong. Furlough them if you can't pay them and won't lay them off. Pay cuts say "I do not value your service enough to pay for it." I don't know anybody who trusts the government to not find something else to spend this money on. You have to EARN trust before the people will follow. No trust here.
Disgusted wrote:
Playing the Game wrote: As a State employee I am offended by having to take a pay cut. There are too many State Employees and programs. The only short term solution is to layoff workers and then begin the process of cutting programs and staffing on a permanent basis.
PtG, I'm also offended. But, with the projected budget deficit at $800 million and apparently growing, I think we'll be fortunate to get our pay cut by only 8%. Unless economics turn fast, I expect that to worsen.
And, Markell isn't going to sign any budget that does not include a substantial pay cut for state workers. IMO, it will be permanent. If the Legislature passes a budget that he vetoes, come July 1, nobody gets paid anything. Markell holds all the cards here.
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Playing the Game
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Posted: Sat May 16th, 2009 04:30 pm |
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And, he is a couple Aces short of a deck. His trump card is a couple of Jokers.
Disgusted wrote:
Markell holds all the cards here.
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Disgusted
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Posted: Sat May 16th, 2009 04:08 pm |
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Playing the Game wrote: As a State employee I am offended by having to take a pay cut. There are too many State Employees and programs. The only short term solution is to layoff workers and then begin the process of cutting programs and staffing on a permanent basis.
PtG, I'm also offended. But, with the projected budget deficit at $800 million and apparently growing, I think we'll be fortunate to get our pay cut by only 8%. Unless economics turn fast, I expect that to worsen.
And, Markell isn't going to sign any budget that does not include a substantial pay cut for state workers. IMO, it will be permanent. If the Legislature passes a budget that he vetoes, come July 1, nobody gets paid anything. Markell holds all the cards here.
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Brainiac
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Posted: Fri May 15th, 2009 05:28 pm |
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| No raises for three years in a row, and then a suggestion that the budget has to be balanced yet again on the state employee's backs by taking a cut in pay whether its 8% or 1% is just incredible. I just hope the anger, the frustration, the fear, and the rage that the state employees feel, transfer to the rest of the tax payers of Delaware, and that these feeling are sustained throughout Markells administration and that they rise up to greet him everyday for the rest of his term/s.
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Playing the Game
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Posted: Fri May 8th, 2009 01:01 pm |
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| As a State employee I am offended by having to take a pay cut. There are too many State Employees and programs. The only short term solution is to layoff workers and then begin the process of cutting programs and staffing on a permanent basis.
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kirkalbertson
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Posted: Fri May 8th, 2009 04:03 am |
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| So let's cut the state employee wages and raise their taxes too. Seems fair to me.
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Hartlyboy
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Posted: Fri May 8th, 2009 03:58 am |
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| Repeat after Two Cents -"It's not a revenue problem , it's a spending problem" Since something like 75% of state operating expenses are salaries it seems inevitable that that's a place to cut expenses. Whether that becomes a hit to everyone or a selective culling remains to be seen, but the pain felt by the other 90% of the state as far as taxes and cutbacks we've had to make are not fun , either.
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Two Cents
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Posted: Thu May 7th, 2009 02:06 pm |
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rv-chas polk rd wrote: So then why talk of cuts in salaries as temporary and for how many years will state employees continue to have to have their salaries cut? More effort should be put into developing new revenue sources.
There is no revenue problem at all -- it's an expense problem. Until the state right-sizes the size of government and eliminates some entitlement programs, it will continue to be an expense problem. Unfortunately, when times were good and money flowed into the state like water into the rivers, nobody saw a reason to control any expenses. Now that the expenses have been built-in during good times, there will be some painful decisions necessary.
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rv-chas polk rd
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Posted: Thu May 7th, 2009 01:58 pm |
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Fred wrote: . . .I am not sure that tapping the rainy day fund for this amount makes sense. It isn't like this is going to be a single year problem.
. . .
So then why talk of cuts in salaries as temporary and for how many years will state employees continue to have to have their salaries cut? More effort should be put into developing new revenue sources.
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cedarcreektramp
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Posted: Thu May 7th, 2009 02:12 am |
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should have known.....I bet Dana Fuchs even knew that 
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Playing the Game
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Posted: Thu May 7th, 2009 02:11 am |
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Well, there are more than 30,000 State Employees and about 800,000 residents. That includes children.
cedarcreektramp wrote:
Playing the Game wrote: Where did you get those figures?
cedarcreektramp wrote:
State employees only make up 6.8% of the residents/voters in the State of Delaware. That leaves a group 93.2% residents/voters who are private sector employees, retired or nanny state takers.
I saw the figure in an article posted by your favorite person ts pong. Is the figure wrong ?
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Two Cents
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Posted: Thu May 7th, 2009 01:56 am |
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kirkalbertson wrote: "A periodic performance review." What in heaven's name is that?
I worked in a private sector management position for an entire career and a semi-annual performance review was a part of an ongoing evaluation process. It provided management the opportunity to compare goals and objectives of an individual employee to his actual perfomance over a specified period of time, and formed the basis for requiring additional education or training, for adjustments to compensation, and indeed as to suitability to remain in one's position or for potential promotion or demotion.
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cedarcreektramp
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Posted: Thu May 7th, 2009 01:49 am |
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Playing the Game wrote: Where did you get those figures?
cedarcreektramp wrote:
State employees only make up 6.8% of the residents/voters in the State of Delaware. That leaves a group 93.2% residents/voters who are private sector employees, retired or nanny state takers.
I saw the figure in an article posted by your favorite person ts pong. Is the figure wrong ?
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kirkalbertson
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 10:58 pm |
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"A periodic performance review." What in heaven's name is that? I guess it's the fear factor so state employees don't get out of line. I can also assume people that earn much more than the average state employee are unsympathetic to their human needs because it doesn't affect them. Unpaid furloughs, unpaid leaves of absence, all of those terms mean unpaid to those that are underpaid to begin with.
It's pretty simple again, if I were a state employee and you told me thank you for your hard work, this year for your annual reward we will be reducing your weekly take home pay, I would let my appreciation show in my job performance. Everyone that is not a state employee needs to remember what exactly $375.00 in weekly take home cash can buy a family. You all must also think of the single parents trying to raise 2 or more children on those wages. 8% is huge, even when using it to figure debt to income ratios for obtaining mortgages and buying automobiles.
Support your state employee even if it doesn't directly affect you, because it does indirectly affect all of us. Disregard the comments of fear and educated reasoning to ease the pain, taking your money away from you, whether it's furloughs or any other masked operation is still taking money away from you. Stand together, unified as 33,000 and you can make somehing happen. Do not let them seperate your numbers. You stand very strong at 33,000 plus the many other citizens like myself that support you.
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Playing the Game
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 10:19 pm |
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Where did you get those figures?
cedarcreektramp wrote:
State employees only make up 6.8% of the residents/voters in the State of Delaware. That leaves a group 93.2% residents/voters who are private sector employees, retired or nanny state takers.
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Two Cents
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 09:42 pm |
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Fred wrote: My theory on the unpaid furlough is that if your base pay doesn't change (so you don't have to "make up" the pay in the out years), AND you could spread out the days lost over the year...and you at least get the days off.
Fred -- I don't disagree for those who can afford those days off, but in the week when one takes a day without pay his paycheck is diminished by 20%. That would hurt me if I was a paycheck to paycheck person closer to the bottom of the pay scales without cash reserves.
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cedarcreektramp
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 09:00 pm |
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| State employees only make up 6.8% of the residents/voters in the State of Delaware. That leaves a group 93.2% residents/voters who are private sector employees, retired or nanny state takers.
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Brainiac
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 08:56 pm |
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| State employee salaries should not be cut at all. It is a lazy approach. They need to roll their sleeves up and find other methods of making up for their outlandish spending habits over the last 8 years, they need to do it now, and they need to cross party lines to get it done. Markell should never have suggested it in the first place. Furloughs would be a much better idea then an 8% cut, but the bottom line 8% less coming into most homes is a significant lifestyle change for most people that work for the state.
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Fred
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 08:33 pm |
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| My theory on the unpaid furlough is that if your base pay doesn't change (so you don't have to "make up" the pay in the out years), AND you could spread out the days lost over the year...and you at least get the days off.
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Two Cents
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 08:11 pm |
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| Fred -- a pay cut vs. furloughs is probably a matter of how close to the edge the employees live. For those who truly are on a paycheck to paycheck basis, no doubt those nearer the bottom of the totem pole, I guess neither is very good, but an unpaid furlough may not be tolerable.
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Fred
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 06:51 pm |
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Sure...and the proposal is, I think, a "worst case" scenario. He has detailed how much money has to be cut, he has detailed how much he is willing to raise taxes...the details have to be worked out by those who pass the bill. If the legislators don't want to pass the pay cut for state workers....fine, but they need to come up with the funding/cuts elsewhere.
Would it be better, for instance, to require all employees to take two or three weeks unpaid leave as a furlough? That might be a solution, one that I'd prefer then to simply work for less....and it doesn't cut my base pay for next year, either.
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Two Cents
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 06:24 pm |
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| Brainiac -- state employees constitute a huge bloc of voters. You have all participated in retaining the same group of legislators in office over that period of time, in spite of their decisions to squander taxpayer dollars on nonsensical expenditures at the expense of the employees. Don't blame me -- I do not vote for incumbents, did not decide to not give you wage increases in recent years, and it is the legislature and not the governor who bears responsibility for this year as well. The governor can only put forth the proposal -- the legislature will do the deciding.
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Brainiac
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 06:16 pm |
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| Two cents, sorry but thats a load of crap. 8% is a hurt that deserves far more than breaks and vacations. Welcome to the anger felt by state employees at an administration that has failed them for the last 8 years. In the last 8 years I remember another job freeze, a complete revamping of OIS that cost a fortune in increased salaries alone with no noticable gain, and 3 or 4 years without a pay increase for state employees. At least in the private sector when times are good professionals encourage their employees to stick around by offering financial incentives. Not the state of Delaware, the most we get is a two percent nod while they say "your welcome."
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Two Cents
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 05:34 pm |
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kirkalbertson wrote: If I were a state employee, and this move towards cutting your income continues, I would use every available sick day I have accumulated, I would slow down my daily output of job related tasks, I would make sure I took every 15 minute break right down to the second, I would schedule my vacation in tandom with all 33,000 other state employees, I would extend my chatting time with every citizen I waited on daily, I would perform only the work related to my job description and I might even let my job efficiency slip just a little to where mistakes might occur.
I for one, would understand the reason for what you would be doing and I would also support any means you use to get your point across to the government.
Mr. Albertson if you were such an employee and I wrote your periodic performance review, you would pay a price far greater than 8 or 10% for that attitude.
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kirkalbertson
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 04:48 pm |
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In scanning the various comments and speaking with state employees this issue is much larger than just on an individual basis.
First of all I want to say after having done business with several state agencies during my 50 years in Delaware I want to make a huge observation, and that is they have never run as efficiently as they do now. And it's not only work related efficiency, it's attitude also. I remember back in the day, it was hard to get a smile from a state employee, which now occurs on a regular basis. The employees are professional but do not leave out the human aspect in relation to their job and the public. This is not an area that needs to be disrupted.
The number of employees I keep hearing are 33,000. That would make this the largest company in Delaware. It is not up to the state employees to carry the burden of government mismanagement and the government should recognize not only the fact they will impact the quality of work, but they will also regress the lives of thousands of people. I will repeat what I've been saying all along, and that is instead of regression look to progression, increase their wages and move the flow of money back into the businesses that support the taxation structure of the state. Why would anyone seriously look to financially cripple any family in this economic period, unless, one, your personal wealth was gained through generational inheritance, or two, you are completely ignorant of the present day needs and costs of running a family and household with relatively low to moderate income.
Tax increases and wage cuts are moves that further force a downward pressure on an allready strained economy. The bulk of taxable prosperity dollars comes from the same people the legislatures plan to tax and reduce wages on. In order to regain positive economic momentum, people need to spend money and they have to have money to spend.
If I were a state employee, and this move towards cutting your income continues, I would use every available sick day I have accumulated, I would slow down my daily output of job related tasks, I would make sure I took every 15 minute break right down to the second, I would schedule my vacation in tandom with all 33,000 other state employees, I would extend my chatting time with every citizen I waited on daily, I would perform only the work related to my job description and I might even let my job efficiency slip just a little to where mistakes might occur.
I for one, would understand the reason for what you would be doing and I would also support any means you use to get your point across to the government. Years ago, workers would strike, today there are just as many legal avenues to pursue to make a statement. Use them.
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Born Country
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 04:20 pm |
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I'll remember. I'll be checking every vote for this budget. Let's get that info. link posted in the forums too. I will help with phone banks, hand out flyers, do whatever is asked of me to campaign against anyone who supports the Markell plan. These people don't deserve to be in office. They are out of touch with the impact their decisions have on real people's lives. It's a necessary requirement for this job. rv-chas polk rd wrote: Two Cents wrote: rv-chas polk rd wrote: You take away the food from our mouths and we'll remember next election day. 
I would have believed this if the state employees had not been denied wage increases for the last couple of years -- but we still have the same legislators for the most part. Reelected in November 2008, weren't they?
Interesting point that should be remember here too is that we have been denied wage increases and now they're taking back what they gave us years ago. What's next??? We have to pay to keep our jobs?
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Two Cents
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 04:05 pm |
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| Each of our elected representatives -- from town councils to the white house relies on our collective poor memories.
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rv-chas polk rd
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 03:35 pm |
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Two Cents wrote: rv-chas polk rd wrote: You take away the food from our mouths and we'll remember next election day.
I would have believed this if the state employees had not been denied wage increases for the last couple of years -- but we still have the same legislators for the most part. Reelected in November 2008, weren't they?
Interesting point that should be remember here too is that we have been denied wage increases and now they're taking back what they gave us years ago. What's next??? We have to pay to keep our jobs?
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rv-chas polk rd
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 03:33 pm |
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Two Cents wrote: rv-chas polk rd wrote: You take away the food from our mouths and we'll remember next election day.
I would have believed this if the state employees had not been denied wage increases for the last couple of years -- but we still have the same legislators for the most part. Reelected in November 2008, weren't they?
Good point. Perhaps what I'm thinking is that we need to START doing this. Other special interest groups vote in a block to put politicians they want in office or to vote those they don't want OUT of office. State employees need to be sure and remember who votes in favor of these cutbacks and vote accordingly next year. Need to remember who came up with this idea (Markell) and NOT return him to office.
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Two Cents
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 03:18 pm |
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rv-chas polk rd wrote: You take away the food from our mouths and we'll remember next election day.
I would have believed this if the state employees had not been denied wage increases for the last couple of years -- but we still have the same legislators for the most part. Reelected in November 2008, weren't they?
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rv-chas polk rd
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 03:13 pm |
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Why does the state worker have to pay in salary cutbacks, to bail out the state as a whole?
What the General Assembly needs to remember is that there are enough state employees, that voting as a whole, can make a significant difference next election year. You take away the food from our mouths and we'll remember next election day.
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rv-chas polk rd
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Posted: Wed May 6th, 2009 03:02 pm |
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On another note . . . let's say the pay cuts go through this year . . . for how long will they last?? Will a trusted employee who's worked and done a good job for years ever be able to make up monies lost?? Or will there be an 8 percent cut this year; another 8 percent cut next year and another 8 percent next year? When do we face facts that we have too many state employees in some agencies; i.e., Education, DHSS, DOT?
Why not at least offer state employees extra vacation days - if you're taking away some of our pay give us something in return; five, six, ten days off to make up for the money you're taking away? Layoffs will probably end up being a reality in time and these salary cutbacks only a stopgap measure; just ensuring we all endure pain. I think the big picture is being missed.
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iceonfire1
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Posted: Mon May 4th, 2009 02:20 pm |
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| Lets be realistic for a moment, wasn't markell the same moron who lost $250,000,000.00? How did he ever keep his job? How do you lose that much money and not lose your job? Could any of us lose that much money and still have a job? Now this is the person elected to run our government, how did the morons of this state elect him? This must be the same morons who elected bush.....TWICE....and wonder why our economy is in the crapper. markell is all about himself, he does not care about state employee's or anyone else for that matter. I hope that the voter of Delaware wise up before the next election and find a more suitable candidate. If you are foolish enough to re-elect markell, you deserve what you get.
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freespeech
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Posted: Sat May 2nd, 2009 01:22 am |
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Don't forget Markell is one of "Ruth's people" he was asleep at the switch or didn't care. You choose but either one makes him not leadership material.
Hartlyboy wrote:
If Ruth's people were controlling the spending in 2004, 05, 06, and 07 to the tune of spending that 20% less you reference, we would have had a significant surplus and reserve to use to get us through this revenue downturn. Instead, we spent most of what we took in like drunken sailors and had only a modest surplus, which was used to balance the 08 or 09 budget . We wouldn't now be humping the taxpayers for more money to keep our bloated state operations going. Just another way of looking at it....
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Playing the Game
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Posted: Thu Apr 30th, 2009 02:40 am |
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Surely you jest Fred..............
Fred wrote:
Well, up until this year, we pretty much had no problems with the budget. One can certainly argue that we should have less spending...but even if we had a budget that was 20% less, do you not see that we would still have seen the same effect with the drop in all the revenue sources?
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Hartlyboy
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Posted: Wed Apr 29th, 2009 10:50 pm |
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| If Ruth's people were controlling the spending in 2004, 05, 06, and 07 to the tune of spending that 20% less you reference, we would have had a significant surplus and reserve to use to get us through this revenue downturn. Instead, we spent most of what we took in like drunken sailors and had only a modest surplus, which was used to balance the 08 or 09 budget . We wouldn't now be humping the taxpayers for more money to keep our bloated state operations going. Just another way of looking at it....
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Fred
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Posted: Wed Apr 29th, 2009 08:14 pm |
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| Well, up until this year, we pretty much had no problems with the budget. One can certainly argue that we should have less spending...but even if we had a budget that was 20% less, do you not see that we would still have seen the same effect with the drop in all the revenue sources?
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laughingoutloud
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Posted: Wed Apr 29th, 2009 03:16 pm |
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See like I said before..... AGREED, there is a much bigger picture 
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USEDUP
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Posted: Wed Apr 29th, 2009 03:16 pm |
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| ESPECIALLY THE DEMOCRAT THAT HAD EVERYTHING TO DO WITH THE RUN AWAY SPENDING IN THE FIRST PLACE !!!!!
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USEDUP
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Posted: Wed Apr 29th, 2009 03:14 pm |
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| AMEN!!! NOW YOU'RE TALKIN'!
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laughingoutloud
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Posted: Wed Apr 29th, 2009 03:12 pm |
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| We are where we are because of the idiots in this state that elected a Democrat AGAIN.
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USEDUP
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Posted: Wed Apr 29th, 2009 02:57 pm |
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WOW !!!
You still don't get it ??
OH, well...that's why we are where we are.
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laughingoutloud
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Posted: Wed Apr 29th, 2009 02:49 pm |
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Sorry USEDUP, LOL was taken
AGREED, there is a much bigger picture. Therefore worrying about a pay cut should be the least of their concerns.
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Fred
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Posted: Mon Apr 27th, 2009 03:12 am |
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The money didn't go anywhere...it went for roads and services. The problem was that those levels of services were matched by the taxes that were coming in, until the economy crashed, and the budget no longer balanced.
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USEDUP
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Posted: Sun Apr 26th, 2009 04:39 pm |
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Right on Brainiac!! My thoughts exactly.....wasn't Markel the secretary of treasury in Ruth Ann Minner's administration???? Where did the money go?? I think he knows!
And "Laughingoutloud".... I would have "gotten it" if you just use "LOL"....
But YOU don't get it do you??? It's not all about losing pay or losing jobs ....WAKE UP and take a look at the BIG PICTURE.!! It is about losing FREEDOM AND OPPORTUNITY inch by inch, step by step!!!
When have you ever seen total decay in economy ("globally") in our history?! It is not an accident... it is a huge plan for world domination by some sick SOB's who want to put us back in the same predicament we were in before we came to this country for Freedom to begin with !!!!
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Brainiac
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Posted: Tue Apr 21st, 2009 09:13 pm |
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| If Markel is going to cut State Employee salaries by even 1% he needs to reveal his plan in a very public and specific way. Currently he is being way too vague about what has to happen to return the pay back to the original pay scales. The public and the state employees deserve to know when their pay will be returned to normal. Especially after two years with no raise, and then when we do get a raise it is a meager 2%. They also need to make public why they aren't using the rainy day fund. Is it because the last administration robbed it blind. Also wasn't Markell the secretary of the treasury during the last administration. Isn't he partially to blame for all the mis-managed funds. Last edited on Tue Apr 21st, 2009 09:35 pm by Brainiac
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laughingoutloud
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Posted: Tue Apr 21st, 2009 07:39 pm |
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Last edited on Wed Apr 29th, 2009 03:10 pm by laughingoutloud
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laughingoutloud
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Posted: Tue Apr 21st, 2009 07:38 pm |
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With the events of the nation today and the ecomony the way it is, State employees should be grateful they only had pay cuts and not job cuts!
Quit complaining and focus on the positive; the fact that unlike many Delawarean's they still have jobs!
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USEDUP
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Posted: Thu Apr 9th, 2009 04:38 pm |
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Please come show support April 15th @ Legislative Mall in Dover 4 -6pm
or any of the other locations!
Someone at work told me " this has nothing to do with our state budget or salary reductions. Yeah right!, That is the stinkin' thinkin' that has gotten us where we are today !!
check it out...... http://taxdayteaparty.com/teaparty/delaware/
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