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43petty
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Posted: Wed Aug 27th, 2008 03:43 am |
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I feel the city has been far from being totally honest with its customers over the years. In 2005
when they said they were going to raise electric rates by $ 0.05 per kwh only one month was
at that rate and then it was applied retroactively on the previous months usage. I calculated each
months rate and it increased every month topping at around $ 0.182 /kwh in March or April's billing.
It was announced it would be at $ 0.15/kwh. following that they went with the contracted agreement.
My bills this spring/summer have been month for month on the prior months usage April 13.5%, May
13.0%, June 14.18%, July 14.70%, and August 14.71%. The increase from May to june was the
normal rate increase for the summer months. I see virtually no change in the rates for July and
August. I don't see how anyone can sa a 26% increase in those numbers
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Zymergy
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Posted: Tue Aug 26th, 2008 02:19 pm |
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The difference being I plan ahead and can afford the bill now or later. I work for a living so I can spend my money how I see fit, and the money I spent on my home theater was worth every penny.
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Playing the Game
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Posted: Mon Aug 25th, 2008 11:27 pm |
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| Thats the good thinking that has this economy in trouble Mr. 100" big screen TV. LOL
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Zymergy
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Posted: Mon Aug 25th, 2008 08:19 pm |
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One way or another we pay so why not later.
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Playing the Game
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Posted: Mon Aug 25th, 2008 06:21 pm |
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| Governments don't absorb costs. The government is us and our money. So you're saying that the taxpayers of Middletown absorbed the additional electric costs.
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Zymergy
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Posted: Mon Aug 25th, 2008 06:09 pm |
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Bluesman wrote: .... My impression is you believe that DMEC and the City should absorb the additional costs.
Middletown did for at least one month.
"Middletown Mayor Kenneth L. Branner Jr. announced at the Aug. 4 council meeting that the town would absorb the added costs and not pass them on to residents -- at least for the time being."Last edited on Mon Aug 25th, 2008 06:09 pm by Zymergy
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Bluesman
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Posted: Mon Aug 25th, 2008 05:52 pm |
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Bud Of KTC wrote: The rich get richer, and the working man continues to support those that abuse him the most.
AMEN
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Bud Of KTC
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Posted: Mon Aug 25th, 2008 03:43 pm |
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Sounds like your son is working to maintain a dwelling he doesn't have much time to live in. But, 12,000,000 illegal immigrants and the massive welfare rosters all thank him.
The more I look around, the more I think that the working man is doing it all backwards. He is only working to keep the same utility companies that abuse him, and the same government that abuses him, in business.
The people who live off the government have it all figured out. They get to stay home with their families and the government gives them housing, food, medical insurance, often a vehicle, and pays their utilities. Meanwhile, we are working two or three jobs, and leaving our kids in daycare for somebody else to raise, so the government can steal from our paychecks and give it to those who won't work, and think it's their entitlement.
On top of that, the utility companies continue to expect more from us when they already have too much. How many billions in profit did Exxon-Mobil post last quarter? How may millions are sitting in the City of Milford coffers now, gathered from overpriced electric bills?
The rich get richer, and the working man continues to support those that abuse him the most.
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Bluesman
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Posted: Mon Aug 25th, 2008 11:19 am |
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Bud Of KTC wrote: I can't imagine getting an electric bill for $2000. Are wages and economic conditions there so different from here that a bill like that is deemed "affordable" or normal?
Bud,
Wages are a bit better, for some jobs but everything else is equally proportional. The big problem was the deregulation and the bill of goods we were sold "it will make electric service an open market and more competetive" unfortunately there are only about 4 major electric conglomerates that control the whole market in the US.
Property was absolutely crazy when we left MA, everyone from NJ, NY that were ready to retire and liked the cold weather moved up that way.
In 2001 the little podunk island we lived on was named #2 fantasy island to retire to by Fortune 500 magazine, and that was the beginning of the end for Plum Island MA. The multi million dollar McMansions went up replacing many of the small year round cottages like we had. It was good for us, when we sold our home but we had watched our property taxes go up from $985.00 a year to over $6,000.00 in 5 years, on a 1550 sq ft house on a 70 x 80 lot.
Unfortunately what was the norm is no longer and what was once deemed unaffordable still is even more so. My oldest son who is 28 and single works 3 jobs just to make his mortgage payment on his condo (nothing fancy at all) , utilities, and auto insurance.
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Bud Of KTC
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Posted: Mon Aug 25th, 2008 03:01 am |
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| I can't imagine getting an electric bill for $2000. Are wages and economic conditions there so different from here that a bill like that is deemed "affordable" or normal?
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Bluesman
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 11:30 pm |
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Bud,
Not disagreeing with your post, but MA has been a deregulated state for years as well.
The $2200.00 figure I mentioned previously was what I paid during the winter months on more than one occassion for a 1500 sq ft house. My average bills other than winter ran about $450.00 a month and we didn't have any A/C.
I'm not pleased that Milford is in fact passing a good portion of the increase to the end user when I see other communities who also belong to DMEC saying they won't have an increase or if there is it will be a minimal one.
I don't doubt either that part of this recent increase is to fund the windfarm that was approved shortly before the increase talk began.
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Bud Of KTC
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 10:01 pm |
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Other electric companies are experiencing the need for increases too. But here's the difference: The City of Milford jacks up electric prices at resale to the public (you and I) to profit enough to run the city. It's not city taxes that pay the city employees, it's the GIGANTIC profit they make from electric. Wasteful city spending, overpaid employees, etc., continue to increase costs, so the answer is to increase electric rates again, and hide behind oil prices to make it seem OK.
A few years ago, it was proven that Milford had the highest electric rates in Delaware. Then, about that same time, a magazine printed electric costs throughout the country and Delaware had the highest electric at that time. That meant that Milfordians paid the highest elelctric rates in the whole USA at that time.
Once, when we moved, we left our former home vacant for a few months. We shut off the water heater, and it was summer, so there was no heat on. The only electrical fixtures left in the house were the lights on the kitchen and bathroom ceilings, and no one was there to use them. The electric bill for July was $87.36! Only in the City of Milford!
Here's how I do the math: Greed + Waste = City of Milford electric bill.
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Bluesman
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 09:38 pm |
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What world do you live in that you believe the costs are going to decline. You don't want to blame the one person directly responsible Richard Carmean. Who knew better than the Chairman of DMEC Richard Carmean.
Transmission costs, are all fixed costs whether it costs .25 or .99 per Kwh it doesn't cost anymore to send the electricity over the poles, through the wires to our homes.
Congestion costs, overhead costs, are when we exceed what the DMEC can produce and or by under contract from other suppliers when they(DMEC) can't meet the demand.
I beg to differ with you belief that no one in Milford did anything. The communities like Milford that are part of DMEC were in fact dealing with it, they didn't pass the costs on initially as they rose. Now they are saying no we can't absorb all the increase, the end user will have to pay some.
Our electric went up $20.00 for the month and we are still under $150.00 a month.
When you get an electric bill that is $2,200.00+ for a month like we had on a regular basis then complain.
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starsandstripes
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 05:55 pm |
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blues, you are right about the state not being involved. its the d.m.e.c. organization that does the buying. yes, milford has a seat on the board of d.m.e.c. so its the city council of milford that has a say about its proportional control of this organization.
pure electic that we use is 7 percent by d.m.e.c. the rest is bought in an open market. it goes up and down all the time.
it , being the price did not just go up in one day. look at any electric charge chart. it rose over time. whiile it was rising we, it appears, did not buy more to control the cost.
we took advantage of buying the 70 percent we needed, so using that same knowledge we were to buy additional supplies as we needed it.
thats the point., we took no action. blame?? nope, just want us as a city to be prepared to buy as the price declines.
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starsandstripes
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 05:47 pm |
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why does every conversation have to turn nasty??why is it when i point out that electric was not monitored by city council for about 16 months in the sense of taking positve action to lower or ,,and, control the cost?
blues, please understand you are referring in your last posting to transmission costs, congestion costs, overhead costs.yes they do indeed rise.
my point is, we are all aware that these costs are subject to large increases.
its the pure electric that our utility, d.m.e.c. buys that is under contract for 70 percent. thats the cost that we needed 100 percent control of.
blame? nope. i do not blame the ex. city manager, nor do i blame the current manager.
the fault is with the oversight folks who are our city council. seven of the eight were in office all this period of time. none of them stood up, looked at the budget, exercised their powers to bring to the attention of city management that they should be taking actions to control the cost of the electric we buy. we even have a paid consultant to advise the city. what did he tell us for 16 months//
THE WAR? WE ALL KNOW ABOUT THAT. THE PRICE OF GAS.. THE PRICE OF ENERGY, WE ALL ARE AWARE THEY WERE RISING.
my point is, any company can forcast, budget, control costs. we knew every day, every month about the rise of pure electric that we buy. it is not rocket science to say, after six months of a contract that we should go out in time and buy additional six months.
the city cannot even tell us at this time how much we own thru december this year, by month, quantity, and price we paid or will have to pay.
to blend price we would need to know even this basic information.
as of june one next year, do we have an additional contract bought at any time?
now you see it, now you don't
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Bluesman
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 01:56 pm |
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starsandstripes wrote: i hold the city council responsible for the city not taking action to lock in our electric costs.we knew it was rising and we as a city took no action to hold the line on increases. as a city we just left it up to dmec and our representative to dmec to monitor the situation.
our city council should have had a committee of volunteers to help monitor the electric. you may not realize it, but, we as a city have many knowledgeable citizens willing and able to give positive advice.
should have...... could have........ would have. 3 phrases that should be struck from the English language.
Quite frankly I haven't seen one bit of positive advice or input from you.
You just want to broad stroke blame everyone for something that no one at the state or local governmental level has any control over. Perhaps you have forgotten we are in a war in Iraq.
Richard Carmean was Milfords representative so if you want to lay blame then at least stand up and blame the right person, by name.
You would rather blame city administrative officials who weren't even elected yet. You want something for nothing and you expect everyone to absorb the increased costs but the end user.
DMEC is a non profit corporation, all they are doing is passing the increases that they are being charged, nothing more. When we peak out for useage that DMEC can generate they have to buy the electricity from some other source, that's where the additional costs come in as well.
Nobody wants to conserve, and cut back on electric useage, like running A/C units at 70-72 or lower degrees all the time. The lowest we set ours was 76 all summer long.
http://www.demecinc.net/documents/DEMEC-SenateEnergyHearingTestimony-05142008_000.pdf
DMEC testimony to The Senate Energy & Transit Committee - May 14, 2008
HOW ARE RGGI ALLOWANCE PRICES REFLECTED IN RETAIL POWER COSTS?
Today, Delaware’s transmission infrastructure is significantly congested. Until new transmission infrastructure goes into service (estimated at 2015?), in-state generation is needed to maintain reliable electric service. Since Delaware is an unregulated state, energy prices are determined by the cost to run in-state generation in a “free market”. Since a significant number of Delaware consumers have their energy costs determined by the Standard Offer Service Auctions, RGGI costs will immediately and directly impact energy prices to Delmarva Power retail consumers. There will be an additional price impact to all Delaware electric consumers as energy suppliers in the market “price in” the risk of RGGI costs to their offered prices.
Retail prices will immediately increase in Delaware as the cost of production is increased by RGGI allowance requirements. Allowance costs will be treated exactly like fuel costs; they will immediately be reflected in the cost of production. Since the Delmarva Peninsula is transmission-constrained, marginal generation in Delaware will set electricity prices. This may actually be a small benefit to DPL Zone consumers, since natural gas is the marginal fuel, and the RGGI cost adder for gas is smaller than coal. However, since the Southern DPL region shows binding constraints in the 2010 PJM transmission studies, all local generation, generation will run a higher percentage of the hours than historically, increasing RGGI costs in Southern Delaware. A high degree of certainty is needed by generator owners and market sellers. Unnecessary uncertainty places financial constraints on local generation owners and dependence on out of RGGI generation resources, raising the market price of energy in the Delaware region. Solid auction rules and known allowance positions reduce volatility and are good for the market and consumers. End users benefit by a phase-in of price increases, rather than being hit with a sudden big increase. A short example of how RGGI allowance costs will impact prices: If natural gas, the marginal fuel, creates .50 ton/mWh of CO, and the allowances cost is $5/Ton (to make the math easy), allowances will add $2.50/mWh to cost of production. If market price of energy is $60/mWh without allowances, the allowance cost pushes it to $62.50, a 4.2% increase. ICF went over this in their RGGI Analysis. I think this is especially true on days when the peninsula transmission congestion is high. Generators and market sellers will immediately price this into energy cost to supply retail load. We should avoid large price increases and volatility whenever we can. This is a situation where we can, by phasing in allowance cost impact to Delaware generators and Delaware electric consumers. I also continue to recommend the legislature work with the utilities to encourage investment in new clean generation resources and robust transmission infrastructure for Delaware to protect the reliability of electric service to our citizens, encourage the local economy and maintain regional competitiveness.
Thank you for this opportunity to share our views on these important issues.
For further information, please contact Patrick E. McCullar, President & CEO,
Delaware Municipal Electric Corporation, (302) 653-2733 FAX (302) 653-2734
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starsandstripes
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 03:26 am |
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i hold the city council responsible for the city not taking action to lock in our electric costs.we knew it was rising and we as a city took no action to hold the line on increases. as a city we just left it up to dmec and our representative to dmec to monitor the situation.
our city council should have had a committee of volunteers to help monitor the electric. you may not realize it, but, we as a city have many knowledgeable citizens willing and able to give positive advice.
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Bluesman
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 02:46 am |
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One question have you seen the actual signed contracts that you can state positively that there are no contingency clauses about fuel cost increases? No I can't believe it because I have lived in communities where we bought our electricity just as Milford does.
Again, look how much petroleum cost went up per barrel and what we paid for an increase percentage wise at the pump.
BTW who exactly do you hold accountable for what happened in Milford's situation?
Here's a clue there was only one person in charge of buying our electricity, at the time the contracts were negotiated and the person is no longer part of Milford's current administration......
Go to the DMEC website and read through some testimony maybe you will understand why there is the increase that all the communites who are part of DMEC have to bear.
Last edited on Sun Aug 24th, 2008 03:03 am by Bluesman
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starsandstripes
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 02:07 am |
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blues, please, be serious! no one expects the city or dmec to pay our electric charges. after all, we own our share of dmec/ its seven cities plus two others that are the partners in dmec.
can't you understand that when a city buys a contract, at a fixed price, for a two year period its locked. period. no clauses. no excuses.
what we did do was buy only 70 percent when we could have, should have, bought 100 perent. how do i know?? easy// it was a 11 to 14 percent decrease from our, at the time cost.so we knew it was a good price at that time.
now, we also agreed to buy more every six months, we agreed to watch the market for price swings and to take advantage of any savings possible.
anyone would have bought more if they are professionals constantly watching the market. they did not do so as i understand it.
as to the price rises. we are not talking about distribution or line charges, just the cost of raw electric that we did not monitor.
how does anyone know a price is rising ? look at the daily price, use software, look at charts, open your eyes.
do you really believe the price went up 27% , which is a 100 percent true electric rise and no one saw it??no one reacted??
we woke up one morning and said, gee, folks its up 100 percent think we should give it some thought<G>
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Bluesman
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Posted: Sun Aug 24th, 2008 12:58 am |
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SnS
what part don't you understand that nobody could have predicted the way the price of crude oil was going to go.
Even if we had a locked in contract I am sure there would be a contingency clause for fuel increases. DMEC didn't expect to get hit as hard as they did either, and it rolls down hill. My impression is you believe that DMEC and the City should absorb the additional costs.
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Opinion Seeker
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Posted: Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 11:11 pm |
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Waterman wrote: I heat with oil and called this week for a price. It is .64 a gallon more at 4.29 a gallon. I am waiting to see if it drops before filling my tank.
Don't hold your breath. Mine only goes up and never down.
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starsandstripes
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Posted: Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 10:17 pm |
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bluesman, whats the b/s that you perceive in the electric charges?
we were told 16 months ago we had a 24 month locked in contract. now it appears it was only 70 percent.
we were to rollover, or foward buy every six months,. we did nothing.
as other cities, they are in the sme pickle as we are. they did not watch the system .
now, does the public really care? will a 70 to 90 percentage increase in electic mean something, or, just accepted as a normal way of things next may??
now you see it, now you don't
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Waterman
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Posted: Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 02:07 pm |
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Bluesman wrote: Stars and Stripes, I'm calling B/S finally. If you read the papers you would find that every other community who uses DMEC is in the same boat as Milford. Are the rates going up of course they are just like everything else that revolves around fuel costs.
Let's calculate how much gasoline, propane, home heating oil prices have gone up percentage wise, just this summer alone. We just had our propane tank filled it cost .30 more a gallon than last season.
I heat with oil and called this week for a price. It is .64 a gallon more at 4.29 a gallon. I am waiting to see if it drops before filling my tank.
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Bluesman
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Posted: Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 01:27 pm |
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Milfordian good morning and thanks for the compliment in another post. 
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milfordian
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Posted: Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 12:48 pm |
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Bluesman wrote: Stars and Stripes, I'm calling B/S finally.
You could do that with 73.45% of what she says, (Yes I am keeping track using a very scientific formula)
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Bluesman
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Posted: Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 12:08 pm |
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Stars and Stripes, I'm calling B/S finally. If you read the papers you would find that every other community who uses DMEC is in the same boat as Milford. Are the rates going up of course they are just like everything else that revolves around fuel costs.
Let's calculate how much gasoline, propane, home heating oil prices have gone up percentage wise, just this summer alone. We just had our propane tank filled it cost .30 more a gallon than last season.
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BitterRoute
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Posted: Sat Aug 23rd, 2008 02:15 am |
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Thank God we are on Delaware Electric Coop! They have been using a program over the summer called "beat the peak". Basically the idea is; ask coop customers to conserve electricity during peak usage hours. Electric costs more to buy from the supplier during peak usage. As the coop customers cut back, the price comes down during the peak purchase rate.
Now why can't Milford implement a similar idea? Instead they base the rates on the day that power is in most demand. Sounds to me that they are looking to capitalize on city residents. No surprise there....
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starsandstripes
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Posted: Fri Aug 22nd, 2008 10:21 pm |
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joke of the week??
our electric utility buys the 30 or even 25 perent of our electric needs in the open market. its a varialbe rate, or day ahead marginal price. we are not even sure what we buy or do not buy<G>.
the average price is about fifty bucks for a megawatt hour and a peak of 70 bucks in may.
on june 10, we had a heat wave and the price was about 225 bucks and a peak of 380 bucks that day.
now i ask?? why are we buying day to day and paying peak prices?? why do we not have a foward out 10, 30, or, even a sixty day buying to protect us from the daily swings??
to pay three of four times the average price , knowing the market can change by the minute is a no brainer,.we should have been buying all our needs on short , medium, and even long term contracts.
to tell the folks in milford the market moved to fast for our several experts and consultants is adding insult to injury as they say in law school<G>>
lets see, ever hear of charts, graphs, even past experience . nope , we did not buy any electric for about 15 months froom may of 2007 going foward.
now that the market is at almost all time highs we are ready to start the process of buying.
now you see it, now you don't
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starsandstripes
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Posted: Fri Aug 22nd, 2008 10:01 pm |
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well, its interesting who or whom really cares about the increases in electric bills in milford.
it was 5.9% in june plus an additional 26 % in july increase.
this 6 plus 26 increase equals 32% acutal increase from the month of may. compounded its really 33 %, but lets not argue about a percent<G>.
now this 32 percent for the entire billing represents only 30 pecent of the purchases of electricity. the remaining 70 percent is under contract till next may30.
so if we were buying without the locked in contract we would be seeing about 100 percent increase .
any math experts reading this blog. will anyone complain about this billing??
you could ask, if we had so many experts studing our electric billing , over time, they would have, or should have, seen to it we made additional purchases as time passed.
they were to always go out 24 months for contracts. did they do so?? nope
they were to watch every day as the price rises of falls. did they? nope, they watched it rise, did nothing, and lo and behold, we have to pay market price.
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43petty
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Posted: Fri Aug 22nd, 2008 03:52 am |
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Are we being lied to? Milford electric told us they had bought 80 or 90 % of our electric at a fixed contract rate for a period of 3 years due to expire next summer I think. Now they tell us the uncontracted portion has gone up by 23%. They have stated they are raising electricity rates by 2 cents per KWH or ~20%. Thus I would figurethat since only the portion outside of the contracted power package should go up not a 20 % increase on the entire rate structure. Who are they trying to fool? A major portion of the cost is locked into the contract.
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