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Global Warming is a Scam
 
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Runnerman
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 Posted: Fri Oct 30th, 2009 12:26 am
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Bixby wrote: Footloose wrote: dover-diva wrote: Bixby wrote: This is a severe warning, too important to dismiss.  It is informative, eye opening, and should be enough to shake some of you Team AGW people off the weather vane.

[size=http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=PMe5dOgbu40]

Posted it to our DE critters-awaiting their responses LOL

Lord Monkton will  be in TV (The Glenn Beck Show) on FNC Friday 10/30/2009 @5PM.  This guy is a cool cat and intelligently exposes the hype and where it is leading the nation and the world.

Oh gullible Team AGO members and supporters, educate thyselves.  Here are some scientific resourcfes to dispute the Team AGW claims:

The individual parts at YouTube are:

Climate Video Part 1:  Introduction; how greenhouse gases work; historical climate reconstructions
Climate Video Part 2:  Historical reconstructions; problems with proxies
Climate Video part 3:  How much warming is due to man; measurement biases; natural cycles in climate
Climate Video Part 4:  Role of the sun; aerosols and cooling; climate sensitivity; checking forecasts against history
Climate Video Part 5:  Positive and negative feedback;  hurricanes.
Climate Video Part 6:  Melting ice and rising oceans; costs of CO2 abatement; conclusions.

You may download a 258MB full resolution Windows Media version of the film by right-clicking here.

You may download a 144MB full resolution Quicktime version of the film by right-clicking here.


Very enlightening.  This should be a must read for everyone so they can flood their representatives offices before they pass on the Cap and Trade legislation.

Bixby
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 Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 07:41 pm
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Footloose wrote: dover-diva wrote: Bixby wrote: This is a severe warning, too important to dismiss.  It is informative, eye opening, and should be enough to shake some of you Team AGW people off the weather vane.

[size=http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=PMe5dOgbu40]

Posted it to our DE critters-awaiting their responses LOL

Lord Monkton will  be in TV (The Glenn Beck Show) on FNC Friday 10/30/2009 @5PM.  This guy is a cool cat and intelligently exposes the hype and where it is leading the nation and the world.

Oh gullible Team AGO members and supporters, educate thyselves.  Here are some scientific resourcfes to dispute the Team AGW claims:

The individual parts at YouTube are:

Climate Video Part 1:  Introduction; how greenhouse gases work; historical climate reconstructions
Climate Video Part 2:  Historical reconstructions; problems with proxies
Climate Video part 3:  How much warming is due to man; measurement biases; natural cycles in climate
Climate Video Part 4:  Role of the sun; aerosols and cooling; climate sensitivity; checking forecasts against history
Climate Video Part 5:  Positive and negative feedback;  hurricanes.
Climate Video Part 6:  Melting ice and rising oceans; costs of CO2 abatement; conclusions.

You may download a 258MB full resolution Windows Media version of the film by right-clicking here.

You may download a 144MB full resolution Quicktime version of the film by right-clicking here.

Footloose
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 Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 07:04 pm
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dover-diva wrote: Bixby wrote: This is a severe warning, too important to dismiss.  It is informative, eye opening, and should be enough to shake some of you Team AGW people off the weather vane.

[size=http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=PMe5dOgbu40]

Posted it to our DE critters-awaiting their responses LOL

Lord Monkton will  be in TV (The Glenn Beck Show) on FNC Friday 10/30/2009 @5PM.  This guy is a cool cat and intelligently exposes the hype and where it is leading the nation and the world.

dover-diva
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 Posted: Tue Oct 27th, 2009 02:11 am
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Bixby wrote: This is a severe warning, too important to dismiss.  It is informative, eye opening, and should be enough to shake some of you Team AGW people off the weather vane.

[size=http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=PMe5dOgbu40]

Posted it to our DE critters-awaiting their responses LOL

Bixby
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 Posted: Mon Oct 26th, 2009 10:15 pm
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This is a severe warning, too important to dismiss.  It is informative, eye opening, and should be enough to shake some of you Team AGW people off the weather vane.

[size=http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=PMe5dOgbu40]

tspong
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 Posted: Fri Oct 23rd, 2009 03:54 pm
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Copied below is a letter to the editor submitted to the Delaware State News. You can post your opinions by clicking on "Reply."

 

I saw an excellent movie this week, "Not Evil Just Wrong" (1 hr 20 min.). The theme was the harm done to ordinary people by the actions of extreme environmentalists. The ares covered were DDT and global warming. Because of Rachel Carsons’s book, "Silent Spring," DDT was banned for years, even though it was found to be relatively harmless. Banning DDT was very harmful because millions have died of malaria that would have been saved by DDT, which is a very effective mosquito killer.


Global warming alarmists want to close down electrical generating plants, thereby destroying jobs. The effect on one family was shown in the movie. Convincing evidence that nature, not human activity, causes global warming was shown in the movie.


The movie supported the belief that extreme environmentalists like everything about the environment except human beings. I suggest searching "Not Evil Just Wrong" on your computer.


William E. Morris


Wilmington

Playing the Game
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 Posted: Wed Oct 21st, 2009 02:50 am
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Fred you have seen the light.

Lavitakus
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 Posted: Tue Oct 20th, 2009 11:47 pm
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Playing the Game wrote: So you are saying that Gore and company are truly a hoax perpetrated on the American people for the benefit of Liberal tax happy politicians.

My OPINION is that the science is screwed up.

 Beyond that, my OPINION is that it's simply a platform for redistribution from the left wing special interest competing with the platform offered by the right which is maintaining the ability to stronghold the free market in general. You know how those earnings keep the market fixing itself, right?

Science is just another asset anymore.Gross profit, for lack of a better word.

Habanero
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 Posted: Tue Oct 20th, 2009 10:06 pm
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John Travolta may be a decent actor, but he is no scientist.

I really, really wish these stupid celebrities would just shut their pieholes about this kind of stuff.  Better yet, the media needs to stop giving them a platform (yeah I know, wishful thinking)

The Insyder
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 Posted: Tue Oct 20th, 2009 08:11 pm
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Global warming, global government? 

Anytime you get someone on the program with the title of 'Lord' you know you've got a great guest. Monckton has long been a global warming skeptic, and it would seem he's on the right track given the Earth hasn't warmed since that famed hottest year on record. Monckton stopped Al Gore's movie from being played in UK schools, and now is on a mission to stop the agreements in Copenhagen, which appears to be the basis for establishing global governments.  Transcript

"Do as I say (not as I do): There are many people who verbally support global warming but their actions tell a very different story. John Travolta, who owns a fleet of five private jets, as well as his very own runway says this, “[Global Warming] is a very valid issue…I’m wondering if we need to think about other planets and dome cities.”

(Arguing with Idiots - pg 97)

 

Habanero
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 Posted: Tue Oct 20th, 2009 06:09 pm
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Playing the Game wrote: So you are saying that Gore and company are truly a hoax perpetrated on the American people for the benefit of Liberal tax happy politicians.
YUP

Playing the Game
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 Posted: Sun Oct 18th, 2009 11:12 pm
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So you are saying that Gore and company are truly a hoax perpetrated on the American people for the benefit of Liberal tax happy politicians.

Lavitakus
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 Posted: Sun Oct 18th, 2009 08:34 pm
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Correct. But by basing "scientific" measurements upon these convenient locations, what they are doing is presenting a false argument.

CaptainObvious
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 Posted: Sun Oct 18th, 2009 07:54 pm
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Hartlyboy wrote:
His data reinforces the theory that if temperature change is man-made it is likely the result of the growth of urban and suburban areas as the population grows [more concrete , heat from engines and factories, etc.]. It also has a lot to do with how and where temperatures are measured at surface level.

It is well known that "heat islands" develop in certain metro areas where a lot of building has occurred-- e.g. more cement, buildings etc.    They retain the heat overnight more than they had before the build up.   Nature of the beast.


Hartlyboy
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 Posted: Sun Oct 18th, 2009 04:50 am
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No, Lav, this isn't about the instrument problem but that is a valid concern that, far from being debunked, has shown up more convincingly with every examination of the issue.

If your belief system has it that there is man-made global warming, no set of facts or information will change that, so my intent isn't to sway your particular bias on the subject. The point here was merely to share an interesting study done by someone who isn't as famous as Al Gore. He's a mere scientist, not a politician that has duped the many for the benefit of the few.

Lavitakus
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 Posted: Sun Oct 18th, 2009 01:38 am
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Hartlyboy wrote: There is so much interesting information about regional temperatures but little of it supports a 'global warming 'theory in my opinion.

 

Dr Vincent Gray, a climate consultant in New Zealand compiled a lot of temperature data measured in 5 degree [lat and longitude, not temperature] blocks and it is fascinating how cold and hot spots exist around the world. It's not one homogenous change in temperature at all, although the overall trend because of some of the really hotter places measured, is up over the past century until 1998.

Dr Gray writes "the pronounced different phases in the surface temp record over the past century and it's highly regional chararcter are incompatible with theoretical explanations based on steady global changes , such as the proposed effects of the increase of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere."

His data reinforces the theory that if temperature change is man-made it is likely the result of the growth of urban and suburban areas as the population grows [more concrete , heat from engines and factories, etc.]. It also has a lot to do with how and where temperatures are measured at surface level.

I'm not sure if he's right but his explanation is as credible as many others out there which indicates to me we really don't know what we are dealing with, -except for a bunch of stumblebums in Congress who think they are saving the world by taxing carbon dioxide.

 


Are you referencing what Bixby posted a while back? I think he had pasted something about these measurement instruments being used near these structures.

If so, those sources are not credible and focus more on the conservative bottom line instead of the problem.

Either way, it comes back to who is making the argument against the issue and we all know who that is.

Hartlyboy
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 Posted: Sat Oct 17th, 2009 10:56 pm
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There is so much interesting information about regional temperatures but little of it supports a 'global warming 'theory in my opinion.

 

Dr Vincent Gray, a climate consultant in New Zealand compiled a lot of temperature data measured in 5 degree [lat and longitude, not temperature] blocks and it is fascinating how cold and hot spots exist around the world. It's not one homogenous change in temperature at all, although the overall trend because of some of the really hotter places measured, is up over the past century until 1998.

Dr Gray writes "the pronounced different phases in the surface temp record over the past century and it's highly regional chararcter are incompatible with theoretical explanations based on steady global changes , such as the proposed effects of the increase of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere."

His data reinforces the theory that if temperature change is man-made it is likely the result of the growth of urban and suburban areas as the population grows [more concrete , heat from engines and factories, etc.]. It also has a lot to do with how and where temperatures are measured at surface level.

I'm not sure if he's right but his explanation is as credible as many others out there which indicates to me we really don't know what we are dealing with, -except for a bunch of stumblebums in Congress who think they are saving the world by taxing carbon dioxide.

 

Last edited on Sat Oct 17th, 2009 10:58 pm by Hartlyboy

Playing the Game
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 Posted: Sat Oct 17th, 2009 07:22 pm
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Easton Maryland where the oblivious one actually lives, is not in the south west.  BTW October is the best time to go to Arizona because the days are still in the High 80's to mid 90's (near triple digits).  How are the nights?  Beautiful.

CaptainObvious wrote:
Hartlyboy wrote:  You are absolutely correct in that you need to look at long term trends, so why the hysteria over 1980 to 1998 when 1999 to 2009 shows a cooling trend? In fact, it shows a cooling trend with extremes at this point with earlier snows and colder temps than they have seen in a half century.

Maybe up north, but in the SW we're still near triple digits and its October.
July was one of the hottest on record.







ltcdolphin
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 Posted: Sat Oct 17th, 2009 06:05 pm
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CaptainObvious wrote: Hartlyboy wrote:  You are absolutely correct in that you need to look at long term trends, so why the hysteria over 1980 to 1998 when 1999 to 2009 shows a cooling trend? In fact, it shows a cooling trend with extremes at this point with earlier snows and colder temps than they have seen in a half century.

Maybe up north, but in the SW we're still near triple digits and its October.
July was one of the hottest on record.








that's what happens in the desert. 

what ever happened with your incorrect ice cap statements??

you never did answer about GREENLAND!!!!!

Last edited on Sat Oct 17th, 2009 06:07 pm by ltcdolphin

CaptainObvious
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 Posted: Sat Oct 17th, 2009 05:22 pm
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Hartlyboy wrote:  You are absolutely correct in that you need to look at long term trends, so why the hysteria over 1980 to 1998 when 1999 to 2009 shows a cooling trend? In fact, it shows a cooling trend with extremes at this point with earlier snows and colder temps than they have seen in a half century.

Maybe up north, but in the SW we're still near triple digits and its October.
July was one of the hottest on record.






Hartlyboy
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 Posted: Sat Oct 17th, 2009 02:51 am
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CaptainObvious wrote: Your link doesn't work.    What is funny is that the article on that site that does talk about antarctic ice melts shows SEVERAL NASA reports talking about greater than average ice melts in Antarctica and Greenland, but only one where its less than average.

2ndly, you can't just look at one year.  Fine, so one year the ice melt is less than the previous, so what?   You have to look at longer term trends and temperatures.   Any given year there can be a colder or warmer year than average.

 

The site has moved the article to a different index but the cross reference to 'antartic' will get you there. To make it easier try;

 

http://www.worldclimatereport.com/index.php/category/climate-changes/polar/antartic  and hit antartic on the list on the right. It should bring up the October 6, 2009 article originally listed under the reference I gave before.

The point of the article is that NASA has published the 'bad news' but when their newest data contradicts those previous reports in a big way, they are silent. Doesn't help the funding in the current political climate , I guess.

You are absolutely correct in that you need to look at long term trends, so why the hysteria over 1980 to 1998 when 1999 to 2009 shows a cooling trend? In fact, it shows a cooling trend with extremes at this point with earlier snows and colder temps than they have seen in a half century.

Last edited on Sat Oct 17th, 2009 03:04 am by Hartlyboy

Playing the Game
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 Posted: Sat Oct 17th, 2009 01:55 am
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Just ask the Dinosaurs.

CaptainObvious
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 Posted: Sat Oct 17th, 2009 01:50 am
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Hartlyboy wrote: Sorry, but even NPR says this is hoey and the current information on the antartic ice melt is directly contradictory to your reference.


http://www.worldclimatereport.com/index.php/2009/10/06/antartic-ice-melt-at-lowest-levels-in-satellite-era/  

Your link doesn't work.    What is funny is that the article on that site that does talk about antarctic ice melts shows SEVERAL NASA reports talking about greater than average ice melts in Antarctica and Greenland, but only one where its less than average.

2ndly, you can't just look at one year.  Fine, so one year the ice melt is less than the previous, so what?   You have to look at longer term trends and temperatures.   Any given year there can be a colder or warmer year than average.

Hartlyboy
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 Posted: Sat Oct 17th, 2009 01:42 am
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State college, PA.  ...Today's snowfall of 6 " was the earliest since 1901 -when the snowfall was 1/8".   Yep, it's time to tax energy to save the world.

 Mikey, are you listening?

ltcdolphin
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 Posted: Thu Oct 15th, 2009 11:16 pm
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Hartlyboy wrote: CaptainObvious wrote: NASA data: Greenland, Antarctic ice melt worseninghttp://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090923/ap_on_sc/us_sci_big_melt


Re: ARCTIC ice.  If it were not significantly reduced the NW passage would not be open to navigation by ships.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/6995999.stm


Sorry, but even NPR says this is hoey and the current information on the antartic ice melt is directly contradictory to your reference.

 

http://www.worldclimatereport.com/index.php/2009/10/06

 

a wam moment.  does this mean that all suposed facts are not truthful oblivious as you have just demonstrated

Hartlyboy
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 Posted: Thu Oct 15th, 2009 11:11 pm
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CaptainObvious wrote: NASA data: Greenland, Antarctic ice melt worseninghttp://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090923/ap_on_sc/us_sci_big_melt


Re: ARCTIC ice.  If it were not significantly reduced the NW passage would not be open to navigation by ships.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/6995999.stm


Sorry, but even NPR says this is hoey and the current information on the antartic ice melt is directly contradictory to your reference.


http://www.worldclimatereport.com/index.php/2009/10/06/antartic-ice-melt-at-lowest-levels-in-satellite-era/  

Last edited on Thu Oct 15th, 2009 11:15 pm by Hartlyboy

ltcdolphin
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 Posted: Thu Oct 15th, 2009 11:01 pm
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CaptainObvious wrote: NASA data: Greenland, Antarctic ice melt worseninghttp://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090923/ap_on_sc/us_sci_big_melt


Re: ARCTIC ice.  If it were not significantly reduced the NW passage would not be open to navigation by ships.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/6995999.stm

nice try wam man.  artic ice is growing, has nothing to do with passages, it's all, about whether there is morte or less ice, and there is more.  now you quote antartica data already shown wrong, wow.  flop flop flop like a fish in the cooler. 

CaptainObvious
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 Posted: Thu Oct 15th, 2009 10:21 pm
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NASA data: Greenland, Antarctic ice melt worseninghttp://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090923/ap_on_sc/us_sci_big_melt


Re: ARCTIC ice.  If it were not significantly reduced the NW passage would not be open to navigation by ships.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/6995999.stm

Hartlyboy
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 Posted: Thu Oct 15th, 2009 06:04 pm
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CaptainObvious wrote: ltcdolphin wrote: ever wonder why people like oblivious avoid the word GREENLAND!!!!  temperatures have been cooling the last two decades it would see, so where;s the warming.  good points by others, and we know some data is flawed based on where the monitoring sites are. 

and we still go back to Time magazine in 1971 and the global cooling scare that said we would all be starving by 2000.  same people that are global warming hysteric's 

I"m not avoiding anything.  WTF does a 1971 article have to do with anything?   At the time, global temps were doing down compared to the average (look the graphs we BOTH posted). 

That has nothing to do with what's happened over the past 20 yrs.

I think the point might be that the media and other agenda setters can sweep the public into hysteria over things they don't understand or have any control over.

CaptainObvious
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 Posted: Thu Oct 15th, 2009 05:05 pm
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ltcdolphin wrote: ever wonder why people like oblivious avoid the word GREENLAND!!!!  temperatures have been cooling the last two decades it would see, so where;s the warming.  good points by others, and we know some data is flawed based on where the monitoring sites are. 

and we still go back to Time magazine in 1971 and the global cooling scare that said we would all be starving by 2000.  same people that are global warming hysteric's 

I"m not avoiding anything.  WTF does a 1971 article have to do with anything?   At the time, global temps were doing down compared to the average (look the graphs we BOTH posted). 

That has nothing to do with what's happened over the past 20 yrs.

ltcdolphin
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 Posted: Thu Oct 15th, 2009 11:46 am
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CaptainObvious wrote: ltcdolphin wrote: big wam time here.  global tempeatures have not been rising but declining in the last 10 plus years.  looks like a made up graph here from oblivious since there is no data reference.  this graph says just the opposite and it's sourced. 

UAH Global Temperature Report for the current month (The University of Alabama in Huntsville)

Global Temperature Report 1978 - 2003 (PDF), Dr. John Christy & Dr. Roy Spencer, Earth System Science Center,  University of Alabama in Huntsville

oblivious, if global warming is real i have one word for you to try and explain:  GREENLAND!!!

love these wam moments, they are so easy and fun. 

You didn't prove or "WAM" anything.  Those graphs are pretty close to each other.  The format of the graph show it slightly differently b/c of the scaling, but the Y axis is essentially the same.

Plus, the graph you showed doesn't have a trend line in it-- so its next to useless.

Ok, here's more data from the NOAA...

Again, the average temps have been going up.   It is NOT necessarily man-made.  

The temps went down from roughly the 40's to early 80's.   But they've been going up since the early 80's.  






ever wonder why people like oblivious avoid the word GREENLAND!!!!  temperatures have been cooling the last two decades it would see, so where;s the warming.  good points by others, and we know some data is flawed based on where the monitoring sites are. 

and we still go back to Time magazine in 1971 and the global cooling scare that said we would all be starving by 2000.  same people that are global warming hysteric's 

Hartlyboy
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 Posted: Thu Oct 15th, 2009 02:44 am
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dover-diva wrote: Yes, more and more "science" is coming out re: Global warming and Mother Nature (and as the OLD commercial said "you can't fool mother nature"),the sun and other factors are more reliable than a bunch of whiny wannabes who already invested monies into a false concept, so "they" can make money off the backs of the taxpayers.  :X
And, lucky us, we have 3 nimrods in Congress who suck up all the hysteria and vote to break us on the wheel of taxation to fix a non-problem.

dover-diva
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 Posted: Thu Oct 15th, 2009 01:05 am
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Yes, more and more "science" is coming out re: Global warming and Mother Nature (and as the OLD commercial said "you can't fool mother nature"),the sun and other factors are more reliable than a bunch of whiny wannabes who already invested monies into a false concept, so "they" can make money off the backs of the taxpayers.  :X

Last edited on Thu Oct 15th, 2009 01:07 am by dover-diva

The Insyder
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 Posted: Wed Oct 14th, 2009 11:47 pm
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Hartlyboy wrote: It would be helpful to understand if the temperature went down from the 40's to the early 80's as you show, then why would it have started to increase in the 80's if it was a man-made factor?

 From the 40's to the 80's we were all burning coal , driving emissions spewing gas hogs, using Freon and in general not giving a rat's patooie about CO2 unless it was causing flat beer. In the 70's we were even all worked up about a coming ice age . So we start to go green , tighten up on emissions, march and shout about all the nasty things fossil fuels are doing to us  -and we get Al Gore, 'global warming' and our nimrods in Congress voting to save the world by running our costs up without a clue as to why the 'global warming' [which has been global cooling for the past ten years] is happening.

Bixby wrote: If only some of you global warmiing/climate change activists would only look at the US Surface Temperature Record, you would ask, "How reliable is it?"  The report contains the results of the first-eve4r comprehensive review of the 1,221 climate monitoring stations overseen by the National Weather Service, the very stations used for US temperature records.

Meteorologist Anthony Watts was given the task of visually inspecting and photographing more than 850 stations.  WHat his inspection revealed was simply astounding, but not too surprising.  In his words, "We found stations located next to the exhaust fans of air conditioning units, surrounded by asphalt parking lots and roads, on blistering hot rooftops, and near sidewalks and buildings that actually absorb and radiate heat.  In fact, we found that 89% of the stations, nearly 9 out of every 10, fail to meet the National Weather Service's own siting requirements."

It was further discovered that those global warming/climate change activists who are spreading the hype are deliberately providing false information. They preferentially use sites affected by these "heat island effects" in their compilations. The US temperature record, which is not adequately corrected for these siting problems, is therefore less reliable than widely supposed.

The constant alarming news headlines touting small temperature fluctuations in this data are used by these advocates of government raxation and rationing of energy to promote their political agenda.  The National Weather Service stations were never intended to provide data for such a purpose.  The stations are not sited and maintained to adequately measure the variations in temperature with location and time needed for this analysys.  No wonder so many of the early advocates are deserting the "consensus" crowd whose ranks are thinning.

Producing the same old now debunked graphs (the "hockey stick" for example) does nothing.  No one denies that GW occurs but to say that it is AGW that is the cause is flat out wrong as well as unsubstantiated.  The ever increasing number of scientists that have since abandoned the "concensus" bandwaqgon proves that the skeptics demand for open debate and peer review is justified.

CaptainObvious
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 Posted: Wed Oct 14th, 2009 10:57 pm
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Hartlyboy wrote: It would be helpful to understand if the temperature went down from the 40's to the early 80's as you show, then why would it have started to increase in the 80's if it was a man-made factor?

 From the 40's to the 80's we were all burning coal , driving emissions spewing gas hogs, using Freon and in general not giving a rat's patooie about CO2 unless it was causing flat beer. In the 70's we were even all worked up about a coming ice age . So we start to go green , tighten up on emissions, march and shout about all the nasty things fossil fuels are doing to us  -and we get Al Gore, 'global warming' and our nimrods in Congress voting to save the world by running our costs up without a clue as to why the 'global warming' [which has been global cooling for the past ten years] is happening.

Exactly.  And from the 80's until today our engines and other things have gotten A LOT cleaner/more efficient.   Granted, much of the developing countries also came online in the past 20 yrs or so.

You should note that they've moved away from the "Global Warming" phrase and calling it "Climate Change".

That's why in many repects the jury is still out on mad-made global warming.

Hartlyboy
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 Posted: Wed Oct 14th, 2009 10:46 pm
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It would be helpful to understand if the temperature went down from the 40's to the early 80's as you show, then why would it have started to increase in the 80's if it was a man-made factor?

 From the 40's to the 80's we were all burning coal , driving emissions spewing gas hogs, using Freon and in general not giving a rat's patooie about CO2 unless it was causing flat beer. In the 70's we were even all worked up about a coming ice age . So we start to go green , tighten up on emissions, march and shout about all the nasty things fossil fuels are doing to us  -and we get Al Gore, 'global warming' and our nimrods in Congress voting to save the world by running our costs up without a clue as to why the 'global warming' [which has been global cooling for the past ten years] is happening.

Last edited on Wed Oct 14th, 2009 10:48 pm by Hartlyboy

CaptainObvious
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 Posted: Wed Oct 14th, 2009 08:25 pm
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ltcdolphin wrote: big wam time here.  global tempeatures have not been rising but declining in the last 10 plus years.  looks like a made up graph here from oblivious since there is no data reference.  this graph says just the opposite and it's sourced. 

UAH Global Temperature Report for the current month (The University of Alabama in Huntsville)

Global Temperature Report 1978 - 2003 (PDF), Dr. John Christy & Dr. Roy Spencer, Earth System Science Center,  University of Alabama in Huntsville

oblivious, if global warming is real i have one word for you to try and explain:  GREENLAND!!!

love these wam moments, they are so easy and fun. 

You didn't prove or "WAM" anything.  Those graphs are pretty close to each other.  The format of the graph show it slightly differently b/c of the scaling, but the Y axis is essentially the same.

Plus, the graph you showed doesn't have a trend line in it-- so its next to useless.

Ok, here's more data from the NOAA...

Again, the average temps have been going up.   It is NOT necessarily man-made.  

The temps went down from roughly the 40's to early 80's.   But they've been going up since the early 80's.  




Last edited on Wed Oct 14th, 2009 09:04 pm by CaptainObvious

ltcdolphin
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 Posted: Wed Oct 14th, 2009 08:13 pm
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big wam time here.  global tempeatures have not been rising but declining in the last 10 plus years.  looks like a made up graph here from oblivious since there is no data reference.  this graph says just the opposite and it's sourced. 

UAH Global Temperature Report for the current month (The University of Alabama in Huntsville)

Global Temperature Report 1978 - 2003 (PDF), Dr. John Christy & Dr. Roy Spencer, Earth System Science Center,  University of Alabama in Huntsville

oblivious, if global warming is real i have one word for you to try and explain:  GREENLAND!!!

love these wam moments, they are so easy and fun. 

 

CaptainObvious
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 Posted: Wed Oct 14th, 2009 07:48 pm
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Global avg. temperatures have been rising.   That doesn't mean that areas will get extremes one way or the other.   Rising temperatures in various places in the world is not easily disputable.   Heck, look at the polar ice cap.  It has receded considerably--  so much so that waters up there where navigable.

The debate and very hard to prove/disprove is if all this man-made.   We've had several periods of global warming and cooling over the ages.





dover-diva
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 Posted: Wed Oct 14th, 2009 07:19 pm
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Bixby wrote: Hartlyboy wrote: Today Austria had the earliest snow in history. Check the temps in Montana for our slice of 'global warming'. And all the evidence to the contrary, our man who would be a Senator voted to tax us to stop all that 'warming'.
Have you noticed the constant PSA's about the Polar bears?  They keep on portraying the extinction of the bears yet the population is increasing every season.  When Sarah Palin was governore (not so long ago) she even offered to take some of the bears and have them habitat in Alaska.  This fact of polar bear "extinction" was recently challenged to The great climatologist, Al Gore, by a journalist.  He was shut down and removed from the microphone rather than have Gore reply.

That's because he had NO reply. Did you see the stupid look on his face?? 3 people wrestling the mike aware from 1 person. Must have been the SEIU.

Bixby
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 Posted: Wed Oct 14th, 2009 04:47 pm
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Hartlyboy wrote: Today Austria had the earliest snow in history. Check the temps in Montana for our slice of 'global warming'. And all the evidence to the contrary, our man who would be a Senator voted to tax us to stop all that 'warming'.
Have you noticed the constant PSA's about the Polar bears?  They keep on portraying the extinction of the bears yet the population is increasing every season.  When Sarah Palin was governore (not so long ago) she even offered to take some of the bears and have them habitat in Alaska.  This fact of polar bear "extinction" was recently challenged to The great climatologist, Al Gore, by a journalist.  He was shut down and removed from the microphone rather than have Gore reply.

Hartlyboy
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 Posted: Wed Oct 14th, 2009 04:16 am
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Today Austria had the earliest snow in history. Check the temps in Montana for our slice of 'global warming'. And all the evidence to the contrary, our man who would be a Senator voted to tax us to stop all that 'warming'.

Newshound
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 Posted: Wed Oct 7th, 2009 04:51 pm
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Vapor Bill - What it Means, Why it Matters, How You Can Stop It

 

dover-diva
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 Posted: Wed Oct 7th, 2009 01:18 pm
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dover-diva wrote:  UN Climate Reports: They Lie - http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/10/un_climate_reports_they_lie.html

Excellent article with graphs and everything. ;)  http://www.AmericanThinker.com

This site still shows the original graphs. Was too big to open.

Cobra
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 Posted: Tue Oct 6th, 2009 10:26 pm
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This fits right in with the post below by ltcdolphin

Bixby wrote:
You know that satellite data, not so cleverly omitted by Team AGW, show that the world has NOT warmed since 2001 even though the carbon dioxide (CO2) levels in the atmosphere increased.  They will tell you that they have record high temperatures measured by thermometers on the ground but as I have shown in other postings, probably under the Cap & Trade forum, the thermometers cannot be trusted because of their positioning in areas not according to NOAA standards such as next to huge commercial air conditioning units, in concrete enclosures, parking lots, etc.  These are areas where heat is generated by the surroundings and do not reflect the ambient air.

Now some of you, just a couple of you, will no doubt attempt to poo-poo this evidence, beating your chests in indignation and holding the Gore Bible in one hand and frantically waving the other hand in wild gestures.  Calm down and check it out for yourself.  Log onto:

http://www.surfacestations.org/odd_sites.htm

ltcdolphin
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 Posted: Tue Oct 6th, 2009 09:54 pm
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they lie just about everywhere as long as they get their way.  here is another glaring example.

 

October 06, 2009

UN Quietly Scrubs Embattled Graph from Climate Report
Marc Sheppard
In yesterday’s article, UN Climate Reports: They Lie, we discussed the problems associated with a chart that appeared in the UN’s most recent climate report.  One such issue was that the graphic, which claimed to establish a “correlation between temperature and CO2,” used a temperature plot immediately recognizable as the infamously debunked “Hockey Stick Graph.”   



And the agency’s timing couldn’t have been worse.  For starters, the immediate recognition of MBH98 on page 5 of the United Nations Environment Programme’s (UNEP) Climate Change Science Compendium 2009 sparked email exchanges which lead to this piece at Climate Audit, which, in turn, lead to immediate on-line outrage among many who write on the subject.  Then, only days later, CA’s Steve Mcintyre received and analyzed data he had been denied for years, which allowed him to debunk the data alarmists had been using to defend the notion that 20th century warming was unprecedented for the millennium. 

 

But as now reported by Anthony Watts at Watt’s Up With That, UNEP has replaced the embattled graphic, which was taken not from peer-reviewed journals but rather a 2005 Wikimedia posting by an unknown Norwegian research biologist, with a more traditional (and carbon free) chart from GISS.  Curiously, no explanation was given for the switch.  UNEP simply treated Hanno 2009 in the same deceitful manner they treat the MWP – as though it were never really there.

Here’s the original page 5, as I first saw it on September 24th:


 

 





And here’s what you’ll find if you pull the PDF
today. Notice the new graph in the upper right hand corner.



 
Not surprisingly, even in choosing the replacement graph -- the UN was less than honest.  After all, while the original depicted the entire millennium, its replacement conveniently begins at 1880, immediately AFTER the post-Little Ice Age warming began.  This slice, in conjunction with the previous graph of post-1960 atmospheric CO2 levels on the same page,  is no-doubt intended to give readers the false impression that modern warming is exceptional and indisputably linked to rising CO2.

Furthermore -- as Anthony correctly points out -- the reconstruction of Global Annual Mean Surface Air Temperature Change used was Hansen et al. (2006).  But that chart has been superseded on the GISS data site by the one below, dated January 2009.   
 


 





It appears the latest downtrend was just too much truth for these UN “scientists” to handle.

Unbelievable. 

Still -- Any idea what may have prompted UNEP’s sudden chart switch decision?

Hartlyboy
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 Posted: Tue Oct 6th, 2009 12:01 am
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The major utilities who have 'embraced the cap and trade ' bill have done so for a very practical reason. It's worth a lot of money to them. The way the bill is written now they get a huge portion of the taxes collected by doing the kinds of things they do anyway. It was a clever way to get some of the big players on board by giving them candy....

The Insyder
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 Posted: Mon Oct 5th, 2009 11:16 pm
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President Obama may not have a comprehensive climate change bill in hand when negotiators meet in Copenhagen in December to try to produce a new agreement on global warming. But the message to major emitters of greenhouse gases in this country — from the executive branch, from the courts and we hope soon from Congress — is increasingly clear: One way or another, emissions are coming down.

On Wednesday, Senators Barbara Boxer and John Kerry introduced their long-awaited bill to impose nationwide limits on greenhouse gas emissions. And — as both a backstop and a goad to Congress — Lisa Jackson, the administrator of the Environmental Protection Agency, issued proposed rules that would regulate emissions from power plants and other large industrial sources.

Both the Senate bill and the E.P.A. proposal would cover about 14,000 power plants, refineries and other large facilities that, together, produce more than 70 percent of the nation’s greenhouse gas emissions. (NY Times)

Yes, emissions are coming down -- that is a natural function of technological development and efficiency driven both by profit motive (human society's most powerful incentive) and a wealthier society's desire for a nice (aesthetically pleasing and "clean") environment. It has absolutely nothing to do with gorebull warming, the misguided attempts to address which will be really bad for society and the environment.

If only The Crone would stop viewing everything through its toxic misanthropy it would realize the path to a cleaner, better world for all lies in development and wealth generation, two things most damaged by absurd AGW fear-driven "actions".

dover-diva
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 Posted: Mon Oct 5th, 2009 10:02 pm
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 UN Climate Reports: They Lie - http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/10/un_climate_reports_they_lie.html

Excellent article with graphs and everything. ;)  http://www.AmericanThinker.com

ltcdolphin
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 Posted: Mon Oct 5th, 2009 08:19 pm
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its a scam and the people involved with it lie to our faces.

 

October 04, 2009

The New Scientist?
Allan Nadel
I enjoy my subscription to The New Scientist in large part for seeing to what lengths they are willing to go to support global warming orthodoxy.  This week's issue, for example, describes a hitherto unobserved and completely unexplained phenomenon involving sudden changes in the temperature of the stratosphere associated with agitation of the wind speed and direction of the ionosphere:



No process known to atmospheric physics would allow a specific local phenomenon like the stratwarm to propagate all the way from the stratosphere above the North Pole to the ionosphere above the equator...Some speculate that this trend is a product of climate change

 

Just last week we read the following:

 

Global population growth has slowed significantly, but it hasn't stopped. By 2050 there may be about 35 per cent more people on Earth than there are today. We are already seeing increasing shortages of food, water and other resources and growing numbers of hungry people.... Nowadays it is understood that the key population-related issue is the destructive pressure human activity is exerting on our life-support systems, posing a growing threat to the sustainability of civilisation... Yet many people still assume that humanity will easily manage to support more than 9 billion people in 2050 and beyond.   Such confidence ignores some grim possibilities.

 

The really surprising thing about this tirade is the name of the authors:  Paul and Anne Ehrlich...you know, the guy who wrote The Population Bomb in 1968, which begins:

 

The battle to feed all of humanity is over. In the 1970s the world will undergo famines -- hundreds of millions of people are going to starve to death...

 

and goes on to state

 

... nothing can be done to avoid mass famine greater than any in history, and radical action is needed to limit the overpopulation.

 

a prediction that, in the event, fell rather wide of the mark.  Who would believe that he's still at it?  He sorta reminds me of Monty Python's Black Knight...I'll never give up!

 

Anyway, the article that inspired me to respond with this essay is a review by Michael Brooks, also in this week's issue, of Don't Be Such a Scientist by Randy Olson.  Mr. Brooks makes the following astounding statements:

 

If you want to get a message across to the public, don't obsess about facts.  Just look at Al Gore's climate change documentary An Inconvenient Truth, Olson says. The film contained more than a few factual errors, but it also had a profound influence on the world's attitude to climate change.  Perhaps compromising on accuracy is a necessary evil...is this really the right way for scientists to go? With climate change, perhaps the end justifies the means... given Gore's success and the prevalence of scientific illiteracy, it remains an interesting path to consider.

 

Let me get this straight:  It's OK to lie. 

 

In an entirely unrelated matter, various artists and other celebrities are rushing to the defense of somebody who drugged and raped a 13 year-old girl.

 

As someone who was taught to love and revere science since his earliest childhood, I don't know which of these two positions is more revolting.  Shakespeare, as usual, has the final word:

O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

 


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